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Craig
Dodge Dakota
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9/02/2005
00:57:05
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 Subject: 4.7 Fuel Econemy question from a V6 guy
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When I was first looking at trucks to buy my first car I drove a 3.9L dakota and a 4.7 liter dakota. The 3.9 didn't have enough power in my opinion so I figured I would order a 4.7 with a stick. This was in the winter of 2003. I ended up deciding to hold off on the V8, hoping to see if the 3.7 from the Liberty ever made it into the Dakota and when it did I drove the 3.7, decided it had sufficient power and went ahead and bought my first truck off the lot. Why I bought a 3.7 is primarily because of fuel econemy, or atleast EPA fuel econemy.
I bought my truck around November of 03 for the record.
The question is, what kind of fuel econemy does your 4.7L get, does anybody have a figure where they divide miles traveled on the tank, by gallons of fuel added to the tank? Anybody have a 4.7 manual and care to share fuel econemy?
Also, engine design guys out there, why is it that the 4.7 gets such poor fuel econemy. I mean my brother's 4.6L F-150 gets about 13 local, about 16 highway. I believe the EPA figures were saying the 4.7 should get about 12 city or so. It's been a while since I've gone car shopping so please excuse my figures if they're a little off.
I have nothing against the V8, just curious about fuel econemy.
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SJ
Dodge Dakota
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9/02/2005
01:14:13
| RE: 4.7 Fuel Econemy question from a V6 guy
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2004 extended cab
4.7L
545-RFE Auto trans
4x4
265/70-16 (31x10.5-16) tires
3.55 rear gears
No mods
17,500 miles
23.45 mpg at 55mph with OD off.
14 - 16 around town.
Slightly better just after I change the oil.
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vern
Dodge Dakota
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9/02/2005
05:51:06
| RE: 4.7 Fuel Econemy question from a V6 guy
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SJ,i,m not trying to slam what you claim you get for mileage,
but you claim 23.45 with the od off,thats very hard to believe when some on this site only get on the highway what you get in the city,so that is what i,m basing this statement from
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OBIO3
Dodge Dakota
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9/02/2005
06:59:32
| RE: 4.7 Fuel Econemy question from a V6 guy
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the man said 23.45 MPG at 55 MPH > Driving 75 will drop that consuderably
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MoltenRedDak
Dodge Dakota
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9/02/2005
08:26:56
| RE: 4.7 Fuel Econemy question from a V6 guy
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'04 CC 4X4 4.7L with a 5-45RFE and 3.55 rear end. I average around 18 mpg city/highway combined driving. I live 31 miles from work with 20 miles of that being interstate driving. I drive 70-75 mph on the interstate.
I'm hoping that a K&N FIPK, tonneau cover and a cat-back might give me a 2 mpg increase to get an average of 20 mpg. I know that if I slowed down to 60-65 mph on the highway that would help, but I would get run over by other traffic.
I had a '98 4X4 CC 5.2L with a 3.55 that averaged 15 mpg under the same conditions, so I'm not disappointed with the 4.7's mileage.
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Hoss01
Dodge Dakota
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9/02/2005
13:23:01
| RE: 4.7 Fuel Econemy question from a V6 guy
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2001 4X4 auto QC 3:55 gears 4.7. I consistently get 15.5 to 16 mpg regardless of town/highway or driving habits. The old truck is set in her ways!
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Kowalski
GenIII
9/02/2005
17:10:08
| RE: 4.7 Fuel Econemy question from a V6 guy
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Craig - I think you're jumping to conclusions based on a wrong EPA estimate. I get 15 mpg with an auto without trying to get good milage at all. I have to tow 5000 lbs for my milage to go as low as what you think the EPA estimate is. As far as I'm concerned, that's good milage for a truck of my Dak's capabilities. I knew I was buying a truck to work, not an econobox.
Lead, follow, or get out of the way
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BubbainGE
Dodge Dakota
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9/02/2005
18:07:41
| RE: 4.7 Fuel Econemy question from a V6 guy
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Ditto Kowalski!! I'm glad to see some numbers that are somewhat consistant to mine (was starting to get worried). I get about 15-16mpg on the autobahn, averaging about 75-85 mph, with an occasional 105-110 mph stretch.
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Jecht
Dodge Dakota
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9/02/2005
18:37:03
| RE: 4.7 Fuel Econemy question from a V6 guy
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I get about 20 to 22 mpg highway driving. that is if I dont have to drive in the mountains. around town about 17 to 18 mpg. the v-6 and the v-8 seems to to get about the same milage. with the 6 getting a lil better more but when it comes to towing thats where you see the v-6 short commings. but it sounds like you wanted the 3.7 so why wondering about the 4.7. yo ufeel the short commings of having a v6 in a dak like the rest of the masses lol
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Idakota
Dodge Dakota
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9/02/2005
18:51:34
| RE: 4.7 Fuel Econemy question from a V6 guy
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I have an 03 cc 4x4 5spd 4.7 and it averages about 14-16 in the city and 18-20 on the highway at 80 mph.
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Hemiman
Dodge Dakota
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9/02/2005
19:05:27
|  RE: 4.7 Fuel Econemy question from a V6 guy
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02 Ext Cab 4.7 5sp auto 3:54 gear K&N, Flow-master Cat Back 130K miles I can get 22 MPG on 2 lane road at 60 MPH or below. 18 MPG all day long
on interstate I also have H.O. cams and 04 intake
I use my cruise most of the time. I put about 6-800 miles a week on my Dakota Have a Safe Weekend.
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Craig
Dodge Dakota
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9/02/2005
22:45:08
| RE: 4.7 Fuel Econemy question from a V6 guy
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Oh she works! I mostly haule in Volume not in Mass. Throwing a coulple of dirbikes in the back or a lawnmower or a few sheets of plywood (using the load floor) do constitute work- I reasoned that the V8 is not necesary for those jobs and I would be suited OK with the 3.7.
That probably saves me money being 17 years old too- the v8 I drove was quite a hotrod, and I don't think that state farm would like the idea of me with the 240+ horsepower the 4.7 offers.
Yes, I do miss having the extra grunt, but with the 392 gears the 3.7 steps out HARD when you want it to. Keep her wound up and it's all good- just lacks the tractability of the V8. I suppose the fact that the V8 probably can pull pretty well with the 3.55s- I know the V6 can't- I probably sacrifice a lot of the V6 advantage with those lovely 3.92s
My fuel econemy figures (cacluclated) run about 18 driving local. I've rarely had it on the highway, but mixed driving will get you about 23. I drive pretty gently most of the time though.
In the long run it doesn't matter that much I suppose.
So, I'm not knocking the V8, just curious more than anything. And I'm not ashamed of my 3.7, and it's NOT A FRIGGEN ECONOBOX!!!!!!!!!
;-)
Kowalski: Isn't that a pretty big warenty no no to put a plow on your Dakota? I would seriously look into that- might not wanna post pics of it with a plow on a forum- at least if Dodge adopts the Mitsubishi warrenty approach.
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Kowalski
GenIII
9/03/2005
09:21:53
|  RE: 4.7 Fuel Econemy question from a V6 guy
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No problem at all. Fisher engineers there products well. They calculate the loads and said plow was fine for my '00 Dak; but they wouldn't recomend one for the weaker 1/2 ton ram that same year. When I mentioned this point to the dealer I bought from, he said the plow would be invisible if it had to go in. It didn't have to go in though, even with the plow and my torsion bars cranked up an extra 2" my suspension and drivetrain have performed fine. My ball joints have been fine at every inspection. No issue anyway since my warranty has run out. The EPA estimate behind your original rant is still wrong...
Lead, follow, or get out of the way
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craig
Dodge Dakota
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9/03/2005
17:47:56
| RE: 4.7 Fuel Econemy question from a V6 guy
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It's good you have a reasonable dealer for such things. I know my owner's guide is plastered with warnings about not using a pow regardless of transmission/engine etc. I have no trouble believing that it gives you no trouble though- I've seen several dakotas a LOT older than yours go a long way with plow and all. Dad had a customer, 3.9 auto, whoe plowed in the winter time in PA. The truck had about 275,000 miles on it or so before we moved away from PA. It had to have its tranny rebuilt once during that time. I think that's pretty respectable, considering the truck spent the summers towing a BIG boat.
I know my local dodge dealer was filled with '00 Rams that year in PA with blown transmissions- and I don't think it voids the warrenty on the Ram either, although I could be mistaken.
I apologize for the incorrect EPA figures- for 2003 they were 15/20 for the 4.7 with a manual. Slightlly lower for the Auto.
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SJ
Dodge Dakota
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9/03/2005
22:53:54
| RE: 4.7 Fuel Econemy question from a V6 guy
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In response to vern.
At 55 with OD on, my mileage drops to about 20 at 55.
I know why, and I've tried to explain it to others on this forum, but I don't seem to be able to find the right words.
The answer is in gear ratios, tire size, HP/TQ curves, tailgate up or down, etc.
For my Dakota, on a level road, OD on is not as fuel-efficient as OD off, until almost 65mph.
In this picture, OD is on, and you can see how low in the rpm range the engine is.
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BlueDAK
Dodge Dakota
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9/04/2005
07:28:57
| RE: 4.7 Fuel Econemy question from a V6 guy
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I have an 02 RC DAK with a 4.7V8, 5spd., and 3.55 gears and have used it to commute about 110miles round trip to/from work for almost 4 years now. On the highway I average 20-22 MPG, this is with lots of time speant crusing at 75-80MPH.
All I can say, this has been a great truck!
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Craig
Dodge Dakota
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9/04/2005
15:51:02
| RE: 4.7 Fuel Econemy question from a V6 guy
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Yes that is the primary advantage of running the 8- those 3.55 gears allow the 8 to make up ground on the highway. Locally though, the 6 has the upper hand. There is a break-even point for fuel econemy a lot of people don't understand as well- if you're making a smalller engine work really really hard you're not going to save fuel by going with the smaller motor.
Case and point; a friend of my Dad's bought a Ford F150 with the 302 a while back. The truck got terriable fuel econemy and barely got out of its own way to boot. I'm sure if that truck wasn't towing around a huge chiipper it would have been allright, but when you're running that 302 at its limits every day it's not going to do any better than the 351 that you could have ordered.
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GraphiteDak
GenIII
9/04/2005
22:40:49
| RE: 4.7 Fuel Econemy question from a V6 guy
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SJ, when I first saw you said with the "OD OFF" I thought that was weird. Until I saw you said you had (265/70) 31's and 3.55's!
At 55 you would be just under 1500 RPM's.
Without OD you would be just 2100 RPM's.
Time for some 4.56's eh?
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SJ
Dodge Dakota
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9/06/2005
14:36:37
| RE: 4.7 Fuel Econemy question from a V6 guy
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Something like that.
Here in the Seattle area, there's lots of hills and such. With OD on at 65 and going up a hill the torque converter unlocks, the computer tries to lock it back up again repeatedly. So I just drive around with the OD off. I could be wrong, but I believe it saves a bit on wear and tear of the transmission clutch packs and converter lockup clutch, and keeps the trans fluid temp down since the converter isn't slipping.
I was considering putting 32" tires on the beast when these original ones wear out, just to fill up the wheel wells, but I think that would compound the problem without changing the front and rear differential ratio as you suggested.
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Craig
Dodge Dakota
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9/06/2005
21:01:36
| RE: 4.7 Fuel Econemy question from a V6 guy
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good idea to lock it out of overdrive- it does save wear and tear on the transmission, and probably ultimately saves fuel. Your truck (assuming it is relatively new) has some kind of logic routine it uses to determine what gear the transmission should remain in given the load present, altitude, and other conditions.
This brings back memories when I was younger. My grandfather had decided to buy a new car. He oredered a '97 Honda CRV- first year they were offered. He then decided that he was getting older and driving less, so he gave it to my dad instead. It was a good little car for us for a while. The annoying thing about it was that it employed "Grade Logic", which was an early attempt at a logic routine for figuring out what gear the car should be in. The problem probably mostly stemmed from the fact that the '97s came with about 160 horsepower, and the car weighed over 3800 pounds at least.
To make a long story short, as soon as you even approached a hill it seemed, the transmission would kick down 2 gears and the car would just SCREAM its way up the hill. This is not even driving the car that hard.
Most cars, like our old CRV did (in a primitive way) "get used to" certain drivers. Often a duty cycle of 30 miles or more can be required for the computer to learn your driving habbits. I am unsure about Dakotas and this feature, having never worked on a newer automatic equiped truck. If you frequently lend your truck, or are borrowing someone else's newer Dakota, you may find the transmission to have the annoying habbit of "hunting gears". It can be very annoying to say the least.
That was a long story to kill time on my part, and ot spark conversation more than anything. I am not saying that your truck is hunting gears for any partiular reason (other than the hills), and having never driven around Seattle area, it is quite probable that the hills are large enough as to confuse the computer.
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KingKota2001
Dodge Dakota
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9/08/2005
08:48:36
| RE: 4.7 Fuel Econemy question from a V6 guy
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Hey SJ...does your truck always run mid-gauge oil pressure readings at 90 to 95 MPH? Any time I get over 1500 RPM or so on mine it's at the upper end of the operating range.
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