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McCracken
Dodge Dakota
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4/02/2002
19:54:30
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 Subject: Top Mods for 5.9L
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I just ordered my truck today. It will be a 2002 QC 4x4 5.9L 3.92LSD. I've looked through alot of posts (one guy swears by it, but someone else will say its junk) but I'm still not sure what mods I should consider right off the bat. You guys w/ 5.9's, what are the one's you just can't live without? I'm just looking to improve street performance, throttle response and towing. Sorry I'm so ignorant about this. I've been driving a 1998 w/ the 3.9 for four years so I'm power hungry!!!!
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Dakaty
GenIII
4/02/2002
20:39:13
| RE: Top Mods for 5.9L
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I personally think the air intake is the best first mod you can do. Don't waste your time with the drop in replacement (although I have one for sale cheap). Go with the K&N FIPK. Its about $250 but it works well for performance, MPG and sound.
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HSKR
Dodge Dakota
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4/02/2002
21:31:41
| RE: Top Mods for 5.9L
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Cold air intake and ported throttle body. The mod I can't live without, you can't get and that's the Mopar PCM.
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5pnt9ltrluv
R/T
4/02/2002
22:20:52
| RE: Top Mods for 5.9L
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Look at mine for your ideas....
Kris
2002 Atlantic Blue R/T
Current Mods: True dual Flowmaster 40 Series Original (dumped), MSD 6A Ignition w/ Blaster SS coil and Taylor Spirocore 8mm, 360 Intakez w/ 9" K&N, Flowmetrics 50mm billet throttle body, JBA ceramic headers, Autolite 3923's, 180 degree T-stat, TPS @ .725 v
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McCracken
Dodge Dakota
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4/02/2002
22:35:47
| RE: Top Mods for 5.9L
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Thanks for the help. Kris you have done alot. How much did all that cost? Do you know for sure what you gained in power or 1/4 mile time? From what I've read not all of your mods directly result in performance gains, but rather are to accomodate other mods. For instance I've heard the 180 T-stat is only for trucks that have other mods that cause them to run hot. Which makes sense, if a $12 part would improve performance that much Dodge would have already done it.
If I was going for the most bang for the buck what would be the first mod or two that I should go for? Is there a consensus on this?
Anybody have an accurate idea of what my stock 1/4 mile and 0-60 times would be with my drivetrain combination?
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Spiler
Dodge Dakota
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4/02/2002
22:49:28
| RE: Top Mods for 5.9L
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Kris' setup is pretty close to mine except I have the mopar pcm. 24# injectors, and m1 intake. I' say I have between $1200 and $1500 in mods. Add another 450 in about 2 weeks for a 75 shot of NOS.
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5pnt9ltrluv
R/T
4/02/2002
22:54:12
| RE: Top Mods for 5.9L
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McCracken- these are just starter mods building up to the 450+HP beast it will be in a month. I dyno'd it today and had a 26hp increase and 35 ft.lbs. torque increase. But it was also humid and i only have 1600 miles on my truck, so the good motor wear has yet to happen. Also, I think the shop might have messed up a setting or 2. I am gonna get a second opinion.
This month I am putting on ported an polished heads, new cams, roller rockers, M1 Intake, and a supercharger. (Warranty.....What Warranty!!!!)
Your 1/4 mile stock times are prolly going to be high 15's low 16's with that 4x4. Maybe mid 15's.
So far I have spent around $2000 "prepping" my engine. By prepping, I mean getting it ready for the supercharger. I did not want to simply "bolt-on" a supercharger, but rather get the FULL benefit of it.
The most benefit you will get is prolly increasing the flow of the engine. Get an intake kit, throttle body (50mm or 52mm if you are not too worried about gas mileage), headers, and muffler. (about $1200) The thermostat mod is not just for hotter engines. It makes your engine run cooler, so your computer thinks it needs to warm up, the computer tells the engine to warm up and it sucks in more air and fuel to do this. It really works well with a less restrictive air intake and exhaust system.
Or you can add an Ignition system. There is some more bang for your buck.
I also think that I have more horse power than indicated cause my dad used to have a truck with 280 hp, and this truck FEELS stronger and faster than that truck.
Kris
2002 Atlantic Blue R/T
Current Mods: True dual Flowmaster 40 Series Original (dumped), MSD 6A Ignition w/ Blaster SS coil and Taylor Spirocore 8mm, 360 Intakez w/ 9" K&N, Flowmetrics 50mm billet throttle body, JBA ceramic headers, Autolite 3923's, 180 degree T-stat, TPS @ .725 v
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HSKR
Dodge Dakota
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4/02/2002
22:55:16
| RE: Top Mods for 5.9L
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Best bang for the buck mods are the free ones. The TV cable adjustment, TPS sensor mod, and IAT sensor relocation. Probably no hp increases, but definite driveability increases. The 180 t-stat will help more than you think, and you can pick up gasket and t-stat from most parts stores for under $10. Throw in a bottle or two of Water Wetter from RedLine. The R/Ts in general, run hot during the summer months when AC is being used. And as far as bigger money mods, I still stand by the cold air intake and ported TB as the first mods.
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HSKR
Dodge Dakota
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4/02/2002
22:58:40
| RE: Top Mods for 5.9L
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Kris, what you are "feeling" is the torque our engines produce, not the hp. A 200hp truck can feel stronger than a 300hp truck if it has more torque to get it off the line. Have you ever driven a deisel truck??? Those things pull hard up to about 20mph. It's because that have some huge low end torque, but low hp numbers. So it is very possible your truck feels stronger, but is actually slower.
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5pnt9ltrluv
R/T
4/02/2002
23:06:32
| RE: Top Mods for 5.9L
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Perhaps...I guess so, I have 380 ft.lbs. of torque now...I guess that could be it. I just think my dyno was a bit low though...
Kris
2002 Atlantic Blue R/T
Current Mods: True dual Flowmaster 40 Series Original (dumped), MSD 6A Ignition w/ Blaster SS coil and Taylor Spirocore 8mm, 360 Intakez w/ 9" K&N, Flowmetrics 50mm billet throttle body, JBA ceramic headers, Autolite 3923's, 180 degree T-stat, TPS @ .725 v
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Spiler
Dodge Dakota
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4/02/2002
23:09:40
| RE: Top Mods for 5.9L
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What RPM is your max torque. Mine hit 425 at 3500 RPM's.
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5pnt9ltrluv
R/T
4/02/2002
23:18:42
| RE: Top Mods for 5.9L
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DANG!! Mine was at 3650. your 425 is flywheel right?
I just looked at the sheet again and I have approx 385 (297.1 flywheel) ft.lbs. of torque not 380
Kris
2002 Atlantic Blue R/T
Current Mods: True dual Flowmaster 40 Series Original (dumped), MSD 6A Ignition w/ Blaster SS coil and Taylor Spirocore 8mm, 360 Intakez w/ 9" K&N, Flowmetrics 50mm billet throttle body, JBA ceramic headers, Autolite 3923's, 180 degree T-stat, TPS @ .725 v
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Hersbird
Dodge Dakota
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4/02/2002
23:29:04
| RE: Top Mods for 5.9L
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I'd reccomend driving your truck awhile and getting a feel of it. it will fell way stronger then the 3.9 you came from. For towing you want to maintain torque. The factory doesn't use the 180 degree t-stat cause it hurts emissions, and that is more important to companies now then a few more HP. If you have the wheel and trie package on the 4x4 then you have some pretty tall tires (31") a deeper gear would feel awesome, but since you have to buy and install two sets it gets pricey (plus I don't even know if you can get a 4.56 for the front). If you installed 4.56 gears in your truck with 31" tall tires it would not turn any more RPM on the highway then a stock R/T does with it's 28" tall tires. It would basically make it seem like you truck just picked up 40 HP and 53 ft-lbs of torque, but it would cost probably $600 and you would lose maybe 1-3 MPG steady state freeway cruising while not towing. Around town and while towing it may not hurt gas mileage at all. If you went with a better exhaust, cold air kit, and TB you might pick that MPG back up, gain some more power across the board but have spent another $1300 if you do the work yourself. The only mod I've done to my R/T is the MP PCM. It seems like a slippery slope, I thought my truck was awesome stock, now I'd never give up the PCM. So it just leaves me wondering how much better it could be with the next mod. By the end of this summer rear tires will be a MUST!
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McCracken
Dodge Dakota
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4/02/2002
23:40:03
| RE: Top Mods for 5.9L
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Thanks again to everyone for your help. Last question: How much can I do before I have to kiss my warranty goodbye?
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Hersbird
Dodge Dakota
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4/03/2002
00:12:25
| RE: Top Mods for 5.9L
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Technically they have to prove the aftermarket part caused the specific failure you want then to fix. Some things like gears have no effect on other parts (besides maybe axles), but something like a supercharger could be blaimed on everything from overheating, to transmission failure.
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ILLI RT
Dodge Dakota
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4/03/2002
08:58:11
| RE: Top Mods for 5.9L
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Hersbird,
Did you have your PCM flashed? How much did it run you $?
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Hersbird
Dodge Dakota
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4/03/2002
18:59:30
| RE: Top Mods for 5.9L
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No I have the Mopar Performance PCM I bought used on e-bay for $150.
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Spiler
Dodge Dakota
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4/03/2002
21:41:41
| RE: Top Mods for 5.9L
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Yes it was flywheel, brand new motor.
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Rob
Dodge Dakota
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4/04/2002
01:13:39
|  Mo Power
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I don't mean to offend anybody, but how come the 5.9 R/T doesn't come with like 350HP out of the box??? I wanted a truck with some speed and car-like handling, and seriously considered the R/T. But I was a bit turned off by the 250 hp figure. It is, after all, a 360 V-8. I expected at least 300 hp. A truck that rocks. But 4.6 Mustangs are making more power, and so is the Camaro and the Ford Lightning. I know these others cost more, but the 5.9 is older technology, using cubes to make power instead of expensive accessories and electronic gadgets. So it should be easier to make more power. I'm sorry, but I was just a little disappointed when I got the brochure. The big engine needs to be a bit more wicked...
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5pnt9ltrluv
R/T
4/04/2002
09:47:17
| RE: Top Mods for 5.9L
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Well, you have to take into account that the R/T is NOT a car. You can't compare it to a rustang or camaro. They are engineered sports cars. Next, the R/T is a MID size truck, the lightning is a FULL size truck. As we speak, the Lightning is king of the FULL size trucks. However, when we start talking about the king of the MID size trucks, then the R/T is definitely king. You can't compare apple to oranges. It is like saying that a motorcycle is faster than a car....
Kris
2002 Atlantic Blue R/T
Current Mods: True dual Flowmaster 40 Series Original (dumped), MSD 6A Ignition w/ Blaster SS coil and Taylor Spirocore 8mm, 360 Intakez w/ 9" K&N, Flowmetrics 50mm billet throttle body, JBA ceramic headers, Autolite 3923's, 180 degree T-stat, TPS @ .725 v
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Hersbird
Dodge Dakota
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4/04/2002
11:43:19
| RE: Top Mods for 5.9L
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Yeh but do those little rustangs make 345 ft-lbs of torque without a supercharger?
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5pnt9ltrluv
R/T
4/04/2002
11:56:04
| RE: Top Mods for 5.9L
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umm...so does the r/t....
Kris
2002 Atlantic Blue R/T
Current Mods: True dual Flowmaster 40 Series Original (dumped), MSD 6A Ignition w/ Blaster SS coil and Taylor Spirocore 8mm, 360 Intakez w/ 9" K&N, Flowmetrics 50mm billet throttle body, JBA ceramic headers, Autolite 3923's, 180 degree T-stat, TPS @ .725 v
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5pnt9ltrluv
R/T
4/04/2002
11:56:50
| RE: Top Mods for 5.9L
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and then again, the R/T is still a truck...
Kris
2002 Atlantic Blue R/T
Current Mods: True dual Flowmaster 40 Series Original (dumped), MSD 6A Ignition w/ Blaster SS coil and Taylor Spirocore 8mm, 360 Intakez w/ 9" K&N, Flowmetrics 50mm billet throttle body, JBA ceramic headers, Autolite 3923's, 180 degree T-stat, TPS @ .725 v
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TommyBoy
Dodge Dakota
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4/04/2002
12:00:51
| RE: Top Mods for 5.9L
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Its not really fair to comopare an R/T to a Lightning because that truck comes with a factory supercharger, R/Ts dont. But if you look at all of Dodge's engines, they are not rated as high in h.p. as most of the others like Ford and Chevy, but i definitely feel like my 4.7L Dak has more useable power than my brother's 5.4L F-150.
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HSKR
Dodge Dakota
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4/04/2002
20:55:58
| RE: Top Mods for 5.9L
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Rob, you need to realize the cast iron 360 in it's current form is designed as a towing motor for the Ram. Dodge made no changes to it before they put it in the R/T. The Mustang and Camaro have aluminum engines designed for hp and to work in that sports "car". The 360 has loads of low end torque the Camaro and Mustangs don't have. That is why we can usually beat them off the line and usually through 1st gear in a street race. You can do some easy mods to the 360 to make it breath easier and open it up and make the engine produce over 300hp at the flywheel for around $1500. 2bbl M1, ported TB, cold air intake and headera with full exhaust. But even then, you still have to overcome the weight difference between the Mustang and Camaro cars and the Dakota truck. Why are you even comparing a truck engine to a sports car engine anyway?? Might as well compare the V-6 Porsches to the V-8 Camaro. How come Porsche can get a V-6 to perform the same as Chevy's V-8s??
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Hersbird
Dodge Dakota
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4/04/2002
21:11:45
| RE: Top Mods for 5.9L
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Kris, I was being a smart alex. Even the best nautrally aspirated 4.6 L from ford makes only 318 ft-lbs of torque and thats the new Mercury Marauder. (that motor will also make 302 HP, yikes!) So it will be interesting to see how fast the Maurader is. It is about as heavy as a R/T, is a 4 speed automatic, and is rear wheel drive although it has more weight over the rear tires. If the mauruader doesn't beat the R/T buy at least 1/2 a sec. in the 1/4 mile with all those advantages, then that alone says something for the old school 360's big, bad, broad, torque curve.
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5pnt9ltrluv
R/T
4/04/2002
23:42:04
| RE: Top Mods for 5.9L
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Hersbird- smartty pants!!! hehe
Kris
2002 Atlantic Blue R/T
Current Mods: True dual Flowmaster 40 Series Original (dumped), MSD 6A Ignition w/ Blaster SS coil and Taylor Spirocore 8mm, 360 Intakez w/ 9" K&N, Flowmetrics 50mm billet throttle body, JBA ceramic headers, Autolite 3923's, 180 degree T-stat, TPS @ .725 v
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Rob
Dodge Dakota
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4/05/2002
00:00:12
| RE: Top Mods for 5.9L
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I was comparing the R/T to the sports cars due to the factory Dakota literature, which gave me the impression that the Dakota R/T is set up like a car. It rides better, sets lower, handles better, and is set up for high performance use versus other trucks. And maybe cars. Not fair to compare against the Lightning? In present condition this is true. But where's the factory supercharger on the Dakota? DC should offer one! Any company that has the guts to produce some of the hottest concept cars surely has the balls to bolt on a supercharger. But with 360 cubes to work with, it really shouldn't need one. 1 hp per cubic inch isn't rocket science these days. I dare say that it's easy, especially with modern head design. That's my big point. Lemme tell ya', the lower HP figures in the entire engine line can't do a lot for sales. Especially today when a 6 banger is harder to sell in a truck than a V8. Yeah, I'm sure that Dodge would charge a price exponentially greater than what it would take to hop it up yourself. But it's good magazine press and comes with a small warranty. They got the hottest car (Viper), why not the quickest truck? Ford's got nothing (that I know of) like the R/T in the midsize, and the S-10 Extreme is a joke. It needs a small block Chevy to deserve that name. Torque figures are good, but so is a diesel. Hmmm....a diesel R/T? Nope, can't swing it. Even though they piss me off a lot by throwing away a lot of good things, I'm still fond of the Mopar.
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HSKR
Dodge Dakota
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4/05/2002
00:31:53
| RE: Top Mods for 5.9L
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The big reason Dodge really hasn't done anything performance related to the engine for the R/T is because they knew it was getting replaced in the near future by the 5.7 hemi. Why spend money on the 5.9 when you can use that money to help develope your new baby the 5.7. I wouldn't want a factory supercharger on my Dakota. It leaves me the option to choose which one I want. And Dodge does have the fastest n/a truck on the market today. Ford just proved they are inferior by having to use a SC to get their truck to perform better than Dodge's n/a 360. ANd once again, we are talking about trucks, not sports cars. Ford uses basically the same engine 5.4L in the Cobra R that they have in the Lightning. The Cobra engine produces the same hp n/a as the Lightning does with a SC bolted on. Why?? Because the Lightning engine is still a truck engine that has to have the torque to tow with. The Cobra needs the hp for it's performance. Same reason the V-10 in the Ram isn't rated the same as the V-10 in the Viper. Two different applications.
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WraithDak
Dodge Dakota
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4/06/2002
01:23:41
| RE: Top Mods for 5.9L
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Ok guys. I did this test with a buddy of mine. We did three runs on a highway here in Va. He has a 2000 Gt Mustang(Manual). I have a 2000 CC R/T. Now I am no race car driver. But, out of all three runs I had him by at least a full cab to bumper in front of him. I also have the added weight of a tonneau cover. If that's not a comparison to a sports car. I don't know what is? If it isn't. It sure put a smile on my face!
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Rob
Dodge Dakota
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4/07/2002
00:17:30
|  RE: Top Mods for 5.9L
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Thank for all the comments on the power of the R/T. I guess I wouldn't put more money in the 5.9 if i were developing the new Hemi, either. Now, I'll have to wait and see if they give the same treatment to the Hemi in the trucks. And meybe I'll hold out for one.
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