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deerridge
GenIII
3/05/2004
14:52:32
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 Subject: RE: 4.7 5.2 5.9 vote
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Look to the future boys. The 4.7L is here to stay. As noted its very little diffrent than the 5.2 stock. You guys mainly like all the add ons available for it. They'll be there after a bit for the 4.7 too. Compare the 5.9 to the 5.7. No contest stock. The high reving more efficent 4.7 gets my vote.
Real Horsepower
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WipLash
R/T
3/05/2004
20:34:33
| RE: 4.7 5.2 5.9 vote
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Deerridge,
I hear you talking, but the fact is that this engine has ran production for 6 model years and there is just now some aftermarket parts available. It's happening way too slow for me. I'm not getting any younger. Just think of the poor guys that bought a 99 Jeep. How long do you wait before you give up and go back to something you know works and there are performance parts available for upgrades? I hate to say it, but I may have to give up on Dodge after I retire/sell my R/T. It's bad enough owning a 5.2/5.9l.
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Ian
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
3/05/2004
21:14:57
| RE: 4.7 5.2 5.9 vote
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How many parts and horsepower do you want? Here a just a few dyno proven parts for the 4.7 in terms of rwhp:
GSmotosports exhaust=14hp
long tube headers=12hp
h.o. cams=14hp
k&n fipk=7hp
kennebell flash=10hp
asp pulley=7hp
That is 64 dyno proven rwhp. That translates into about 80hp at the crank considereing a 20% drivetrain loss. Thus, with dyno proven mods, the 4.7 is easily at 310 hp at the crank. This does not even take into consideration other available mods such as a larger tb (which although i havent seen a dyno for many have reported faster times at the track and my butt dyno tells me it makes a significant gain) and ported and polished heads. For arguments sake, lets take typical gains for tb and heads, which are about 7rwhp and 20rwhp respectively. That makes for like another 35hp at the crank. Now we are talking about 345 at the crank. Hemi's get out of the way!
Anyways, to make a long story short, it is inaccurate to suggest there is a lack of parts available for the 4.7. You may have had a point some time ago, but more parts are coming out for the 4.7 (thanks in large part to krc, gsmotorsports, fastman, hughes, etc) all the time, thus your main argument against the 4.7 is out the window. Although a 5.2 and 5.9 still have more parts available, 345hp is not something to scoff at. For a large majority of us out there that arent trying to build a drag racer but merely a street killer there are plenty of parts available for the 4.7. Don't knock the 4.7 just b/c you lacked the patience.
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WipLash
R/T
3/06/2004
00:22:34
| RE: 4.7 5.2 5.9 vote
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HO cams isn't AFTERMARKET! I said nothing about factory parts or modifying existing parts. I want AFTERMARKET!! Read my lips. AFTERMARKET, AFTERMARKET.........I want the flexibilty to be able to pick up the phone and order a complete bottom end or top end package. You can't do that with a 4.7.
All the pieces are already there for the 5.2/5.9. A 409 crate engine is yours at the touch of a button and a swipe of the credit card. If you have a 4.7L, you are S.O.L.!
With the exception of the exhaust and air filters, none of that stuff you mentioned is aftermarket. If I could get a flash for the 2002, I would have to do go without my truck while I waited for the PCM to return. Then you can't ever go to the dealer because they might reflash the damn thing back. The Flashes you refer to are only good for 2001 and OLDER models. My 4.7L is a 2002 model.
Where are the heads, intakes, pistons, crankshafts, rods, cams, PCM's? Where is the 330ci stroker crate motor? You can't even buy an oversized piston from the factory! You have to buy the stock bore replacement and it comes preassembled with the rod. If you want an intake you have to modify a stock one. That is B.S.!
This engine has been in production for 6 years now. 3 years after the introduction of the MAGNUM engine you could buy R/T heads, R/T cams, roller rockers, and headers. Then it wasn't a year later that you could buy the M1 intake. The PCM upgrades were available almost imediately. I bought a performance PCM for my 1992 5.2L 6 months after I purchased the truck and that was it's first year of production. You still can't get one for my 2002 4.7L and it is in its 6th year of production!
Hell, they are already making stuff for the HEMI! What gives?
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Kowalski
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
3/06/2004
07:33:11
|  RE: 4.7 5.2 5.9 vote
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So what if the HO cams aren't aftermarket - he was only giving you the conservative alternative - higher performance aftermarket grinds ARE available ! "If" you could get a flash ? Isn't the Kenne Bell flash is available for your '02 ? If you don't want the dealer to flash it back, put a piece of masking tape over the obdii part with instructions for them to leave it alone; or get a boneyard PCM like I did so they will never have a chance to touch your custom PCM. It's tough to justify all the negativity you have towards this motor.
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deerridge
GenIII
3/06/2004
10:59:23
| RE: 4.7 5.2 5.9 vote
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Or don't ever let the dealer touch it anyway. Mine hasn't been back to the dealer since the first free oil change. I certainly wouldn't let him touch my PCM. As the Fan shows there is alot of Power available above stock that the average guy can have without being a mechanical engineer or a full time wrench head. It really is still a truck boys, not a race car.
Real Horsepower
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Trukguy
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
3/06/2004
11:47:44
| RE: 4.7 5.2 5.9 vote
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Message:
Why bother arguing with Whiplash?
No matter WHAT is said to him he will just come back and argue like he didn't read yours or he'll make another argument that's not even related to the first one. In case anybody hasn't figured it out yet - Whiplash likes to argue online. He's using this forum (DD) not for it's information content, but to entertain himself by trying to stir up all the 4.7 guys with his continuous drivel.
To sum it up:
DodgeDakotas.com = WhiplashArgumentsAgainstThe4point7.com
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WipLash
R/T
3/07/2004
16:24:05
| RE: 4.7 5.2 5.9 vote
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Message:
I'm stating facts. You all are the ones arguing for something that doesn't exist. You can call almost any aftermarket manufacture of performance parts and 90% of them offer something for the 5.2/5.9L. Almost none of them offer anything for the 4.7L. That's simple facts. Every time I state the facts all of you "poor little me" 4.7L owners have to jump on here and justify your reasoning for buying the damn thing. I BOUGHT ONE TOO!!!
I got rid of it. It's bad enough having a 5.9L and trying to find aftermarket parts for it.
Kowalski,
You can get a cam ground for a Yugo. So, what's your point?
My point is you can't pick up the phone and call Crane or Competition cams and have one NEXT-DAY-AIRED. You can't call Keith Black and have a set of pistons next day aired. You can't call Manely and have a set of forged steel rods delivered. You have to wait on some Yahoo to GRIND you a cam or make you a set of pistons. That's not good for marketing. Enthusiest buy vehicles they can upgrade easily. If Dodge wants to increase it's sales they will make it a priority to offer more parts for the 4.7L. Otherwise, everyone will continue to buy Chevys and Fords over Dodges.
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deerridge
GenIII
3/08/2004
15:25:49
| RE: 4.7 5.2 5.9 vote
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Message:
The mass market controls what is available. If enough people want it, it will come. Dodge, Chevy, Ford etc. couldn't care less about the specialty market. A few guys, like KRC, K&N, Gibson, Keene Bell and so forth make their living on us. That's where we'll have to find the stuff we want. The 4.7 is a fine engine and with a few of those tweeks previously mentioned it will hang with its fathers and uncles the 5.2 and 5.9. I was pulling a 7500 lb tow around the mountains yesterday with just two or three of those tweeks. It pull much better and smoother that my 350 Silverado ever did.
Real Horsepower
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WipLash
R/T
3/08/2004
22:18:49
| RE: 4.7 5.2 5.9 vote
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Message:
I'm not too impressed with the 350 chevy either. It's seems like Chevy has done to it what DC did to the 5.9. I do like the new 5.4L Triton V8 Ford has unleashed. I'm very careful about what Ford I pull up next to at the red light these days. That's why I'm getting ready to make some upgrades. Up until this year, I had no problem beating a stock Ford or Chevy with my 4.7L or my 5.9L. I'm upgrading the exhaust this month. Next month I hope to install the R/T cam. Those 2 mods should put me back in front of those freaken 5.4L Tritons!
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Trukguy
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
3/09/2004
02:03:22
| RE: 4.7 5.2 5.9 vote
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Message:
I guess you didn't read the DogKota article in Hot Rod magazine a couple of years ago? They LOST hp when they installed the R/T cam. I can't believe you're worried about a 5.4L Triton. I could see some concern over the Lightning engine combination, but naturally aspirated it should be nothing for you to be worried about. Just how slow are your trucks?
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deerridge
GenIII
3/09/2004
12:30:06
| RE: 4.7 5.2 5.9 vote
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Message:
My neighbor has a new f150. Its just big and heavy compared to previous years. I went and looked at the new Titan too. Its a direct copy to my eye of the F150. I wouldn't want either one. Ugly and hard to get stuff in or out of the bed, because it's so deep over the side. That extra 800 to 1000 lbs over a Dak doesn't help them either.
Real Horsepower
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WipLash
R/T
3/09/2004
13:42:44
| RE: 4.7 5.2 5.9 vote
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Message:
I've already been beat by 3 2004 f150's with the 5.4L 3valve per cyl. V8's. All three were RC SWB F150's.
Why would I be worried about a Lightning? That would be like Cavilier owner being worried about a SRT-4. The Dakota and the Lighting are only seperated by 130hp.
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WipLash
R/T
3/09/2004
13:47:48
| RE: 4.7 5.2 5.9 vote
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Message:
Besides that, I'm not as worried about the HP gains vs. losses as much as I am the torque in the upper RPM range. THE 5.9L doesn't make enough torque above 4K to shift out properly. The R/T cam brings the Torque numbers above 3500rpm up about 100ft-lb. I don't need anymore low end torque. It turns the tires over too easy as it is.
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RTbill
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
3/09/2004
14:25:34
|  RE: 4.7 5.2 5.9 vote
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I had a good feeling about the "new" 4.7L until I bought a used 2001 Quad Cab with one...WHERE'S THE OIL PRESSURE? Since Jan. 10, 2004 the oil pressure has dipped to ZERO and stayed there four times. I have had to pull over and leave the damn thing overnight and call for help. Next day it comes back? I have flushed the crankcase twice now with a good engine oil flush and nothing bad came out, but after this last event I had it towed to a shop and told them to pull the pan! It's there now. As soon as I get it back on the road ($$$$) it's for sale....CHEAP! Back to Chevy for me.
Wife's 2000 Durango 5.9L OK so far. But all the rear axel & differential bearings had to be replaced at 78,000! I had a 1987 Chevy S-10 Blazer that went 310,000 before I gave it to my sister and I never touched the rear end. The tranny has been out three times though.
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