2004 Dakotas - Dodge Dakota Forum

RE: 2004 Dakotas
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Haven't heard much, but I don't think the new Dakota is due to come out until the 2005 model year. I think that is also the time they are switching the 3.9 V6 to the 3.7 V6 and also changing the 4.7 to the 4.7 HO.

Does anyone know if the 4.7 HO will be the only 4.7 option? Or will it essentially be a second V8 option for the Dakota?

Again, not too much word out there on the 2004 Dakotas?

Mopar12
Dodge Dakota
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5/20/2003
20:50:50

RE: 2004 Dakotas
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I ordered an '03 Dakota today, after searching like crazy about the '04's. I didn't want to get f'd by them offering rear suicide doors on the club cab and a new more potent engine. There is little info out there, but what made up my mind was an add in the paper from a local dealer offering '04 Dakota SXT's. The picture they offered showed no apparent differences. Plus, by ordering an '03 (time is running out to get an '03) I'll get the $3000 rebate that is being offred now.

Tim
Dodge Dakota
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5/21/2003
11:45:43

RE: 2003 Dakotas
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Im trying to decide between a 2003 dakota 4x4 quad cab/ or a 2003 dodge ram 4x4 quad cab.
Can anyone provide me with past experience information on either one?
It would be helpful in making the decision on which one to buy.
tks

Dan
Dodge Dakota
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5/22/2003
09:39:17

RE: 2004 Dakotas
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I havn't heard much on the 2004 dak and I work at a chrysler dealership. But I could imagine if they are redesigning the durango for 2004. The dak won't be far behind. And They are putting the hemi under the hood of the durango. So I bet they will probbaly for the dak. Might as well be the new R/T motor.

Better B Good
Dodge Dakota
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5/23/2003
04:21:10

RE: 2004 Dakotas
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I hope the folks in Stuttgart have a few tricks up their sleeves because when the Chevy Colorado comes out I think it's going to lay a major ass whooping on Dakota sales.

The Z71 extended with the Vortec 3500 sounds looks like one sweet truck.

Krapkota
Dodge Dakota
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5/23/2003
14:10:55

RE: 2004 Dakotas
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I agree, Better B Good. My Dakota "looks" nice but I have had so many problems with it from warped rotors at 1200 miles that the stealership would not fix under warranty, to paint that scratches when you look at it to missing trim pieces from the factory.

As far as I'm concerned, the Germans can go to hell. I'm buying an American truck next time and if the Colorado liveds up to the hype, that's the one. Don't get me wrong, I love my Krapkota (as I call it) but I can't stand that Dodge is no longer American and I can't stand the quality issues.

Joey
Dodge Dakota
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5/24/2003
21:59:03

RE: 2004 Dakotas
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Dodge may not be totally american anymore but the dakota is... remember it was designed in 1997 before the big merger with mercedes.

DodgeIsGerman
Dodge Dakota
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5/24/2003
23:53:46

RE: 2004 Dakotas
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Dodge is German. You love German trucks. You people are traitors. Dodge is owned by Germans. All the Dodge executives are German. You people love Nazi trucks. Zieg Heil. Long live Chevy...a non Nazi truck. Fukc you.

HSKR
Dodge Dakota
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5/25/2003
19:42:49

RE: 2004 Dakotas
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And you really think Ford and Chevy are Amreican?? They are justr as much foreign as Dodge. It's just that they aren't foreign owned. You have Ford and Mazda together, and Chevy and Izuzu. I think I'd rather be paired with Mercedes Benze than either of those two.

Daily_Chuckle
Dodge Dakota
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6/25/2003
10:07:57

RE: 2004 Dakotas
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Normally I wouldn't waste my time responding to moronic threads like this one, but before you characters all go off barking in the wrong direction, consider this:

Chrysler had no other choice buy to find a buyer because they sacked all their own people as a 'cost-cutting' measure. Most of the designers & engineers between 25 and 50 were let go, so they lost a lot of knowledge on how to make vehicles and they had no bench left either.

Mercedes does not have problems with suspension parts completely wearing out after 15,000 miles, rotors warping after 1,500, paint wearing off, etc. Racking up a half-million miles on a Benz is not rare. Seems to me Chrysler and customers got a good deal here.

Dean
Dodge Dakota
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6/25/2003
11:13:51

RE: 2004 Dakotas
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I hear the 2004 dakotas will increase in length approx 1-2 inches and 3-4 inches in width with the 5.7 hemi as an option. The local dealer has given me this news. The hemi would be a nice option for the 4X4. Noe that the 318 & 360 are no longer being produced they also say the 4.7 will eventually dissapear too leaving only the Hemi.

dcxer
Dodge Dakota
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6/25/2003
12:57:28

RE: 2004 Dakotas
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First the the bad news 4.7L isn't going anywhere for a long time.Too much investment made.(it has its own plant)Now the good news,in the future it will be heavily modified to become what it should have been in the first place.Way beyond HO specs or configruration are in the cards.

Demon Dakota
DakotaEnthusiast

6/25/2003
14:54:26

RE: 2004 Dakotas
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Forgive me if I sound harsh, but I'm raising the BS flag on any info posted on this forum without any info from another verifiable souce regarding the 2004 or 2005 Dodge Dakota. No one here knows what's going to happen, and if they did, they couldn't say anything without some kind of legal problems. Hell, I'm part owner of a dealer and I have no clue. They won't even drop us a hint...

K&N Drop in AF (CAI during summer months)
True Dual exhaust and removed third cat
HO Cams & HO Intake
FASTMAN 70mm TB
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2K1CC4.7L4X4
Dodge Dakota
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6/25/2003
17:48:25

RE: 2004 Dakotas
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From Allpar

The State and Future of Chrysler, June 2003

A quick look at Allpar's forums will show that there has been much debate over Chrysler's post-acquisition status and future. Few have been arguing that the acquisition (or merger) was beneficial to Chrysler Corporation or its shareholders, most of which seem to have sold their stock. However, we can take the acquisition as given and consider what the future holds, and where Chrysler stands at the moment.

Negative results of the merger
We have on one hand the cost-cutting measures, which have been described by some as "insane," by others as necessary. A balanced view may be that massive cost cutting was necessary but the way it was done was, at best, inadvisable. Chrysler lost many experienced engineers, including most of the Viper team, and many were simply fired or layed off without any compensation package. They moved on to GM, Ford, and others, taking with them a strong dislike of DaimlerChrysler. For example, the Ford GT is essentially the third-generation Viper, with better corporate backing. Much of the team is there - those who did not manage to get into the SRT team. The unfortunate result is that Chrysler's engineering staff is at a historic level of inexperience. Meanwhile, one plant expansion and modernization (Windsor) was halted, a brand new, state of the art plant in Brazil shut down, and suppliers publicly embarassed by an unreasonable demand for an across the board 15% cut in costs - despite the success of Chrysler's supplier partnership model before the merger.

Some other major problems of the merger include people who will no longer buy Chrysler products because they are not American; a perhaps larger set of people who, finding that Plymouth is no longer around, shop elsewhere; the demolition of workers' trust in Chrysler management; the demolition of customers' trust; the erosion of the Chrysler success aura that lived so briefly in the 1990s; discord between Chrysler and suppliers; the loss of talent at all levels; the loss of employee empowerment and involvement; and the horrific marketing and public relations, including terribly botched product launches, that followed the merger, making Chrysler's previous ineffectual marketing and PR actually look good.

Benefits of the merger
On the other hand, we are also seeing benefits in the merging of three major automakers, with the ability to pool knowledge and components for cost savings in design and construction. Chrysler PR has told us every time a Mercedes part is used, it seems, but very quietly, Mercedes will also be incorporating Chrysler and Mitsubishi pieces.

The new design model is essentially an electronically enabled "fit the pieces together" system. Electronically, the system is backed up by a powerful extension of Chrysler's old computer systems. Indeed, Chrysler's IT people are not only in charge of corporate IT, but in charge of Mitsubishi IT now.

Even the supplier partnerships seem to be continuing - Chrysler's only board representatives are both from the supplier arena. Despite Dieter Zetsche's macho stance, supplier relationships seem to be returning to the innovative partnership model, with Chrysler people in charge for the whole corporation. Some vendors were booted out, but this process of removing suppliers and concentrating on a smaller number of better vendors began when Chrysler was still in charge.

Chrysler really has saved a good deal of money from some partnerships. The Crossfire, though it is a past-model SLK, has been getting fantastic reviews, with the consensus being that it is better than the much-more-expensive SLK itself. The LX will indeed benefit from Mercedes transmissions, and if we believe the PR folk, the prior electronic architecture would not have supported the nav system or active suspension. The E-class suspension apparently brings benefits as well, and Mercedes does have a state of the art wind tunnel (as does Chrysler).

There are actual economies of scale in some cases - the shared engine with Mitsubishi and Hyundai, shared bolts and bushings and things, and being able to share telematics and other technologies. Chrysler's promising fuel cell research seems to have been abandoned, but its hybrid program is continuing, and moving fuel cell efforts to Mercedes may well save a good deal of time and money. Mercedes has more experience with active suspensions and other luxury items, as well. Unfortunately, Mercedes quality has been moving downhill fast - we can only hope this doesn't affect Chrysler, especially with the German-built Crossfire.

The future - not as bad as we thoughtThe good news is also that Chrysler is not being made a simple re-branding outlet for old Mercedes and current Mitsubishi models. While platforms will be shared, it is important to realize what exactly a platform is - as Gary wrote, "a basic dimensional design. On the K platform, the frame, suspension and drivetrain mounting points and firewall were common. The platform determines body width, firewall height and to some degree the length because of front suspension points being located an established distance from the driver position."

Both of Chrysler's current front drive car platforms are being replaced by Mitsubishi platforms, and that has been a point of contention, with the LX getting a sizable number of Mercedes bits. Dan Minick, however, pointed out that it is the newest design, already engineered for four wheel drive, and very flexible - and may appease Mitsubishi, which has faced the largest cuts.

This jibes with reports from others that Chrysler is indeed doing a heavy amount of engineering in the small and medium sized cars. In short, while perhaps the cosmetic differences between the Dodge and Chrysler LX models already shown are very slight, the differences between the Mitsubishis and Chryslers will extend beyond sheet metal and suspension tuning.

Corporate parts modelFor the moment, components can still be labelled according to their source - the Mercedes transmissions, the Chrysler engines. The new joint-venture "world engine," though, is the shape of things to come. Dan Minick again:

Global Four, for example. I would guess a "hemi theme" or "magnum" theme to Chryslers version, a "rally theme" for Mitsu's version, and a "smooth, quiet" theme for MB. Same basic engineering, but different cams, valving, induction, compression ratios, etc. Dimensions, such as bore center to center, crank journal size, crank castings, etc. would be common to ensure same line production.

All the divisions work together on a common component, develop a basic framework that will match all needs, then use different tuning to get what they need. Mercedes, with its higher cost tolerances, can go all out for quietness and level power output. Dodge can let the exhaust and intake scream, and go for maximum acceleration, perhaps with an emphasis on torque, while Mitsubishi opts for horsepower, and Chrysler goes somewhere between, with quiet torque but not quite at the Mercedes level. New components are being designed cross-company. Dan pointed out that this is really the old Chrysler Corporation model: Chrysler, Dodge, and Plymouth shared basic engine designs, but they modified and renamed them for their own needs. Chrysler might use hemi heads to raise power, Plymouth poly heads to save money.

Take the basic hard points (firewall, floorpan stampings, front fender understructure, and mounting points for powertrain cradle), these are all key areas in crash development. The designers can use existing parts bins in CAD design, to use on shelf parts and find the best fit automatically from existing stock, or resize and suggest parts (all done automatically). Any skin, front clip, length, height, etc. can be done this way - any suspension using any combination of parts, any powertrain. Just plug in the appropriate engine cradle for straight or sideways configurations, front wheel drive, rear drive, etc. Think K-car, minivan, C-body, Daytona, etc. all from the same basic parts chest, except we've got a much bigger toy chest to choose parts from now. Brand specific parts that need to be brand specific for feel, ride, execution, are chosen with that target in mind. Since the original goal is to make it flexible, it can be designed in from the beginning to be flexible.

In the case of the Lancer and Galant, these are used as the root, but only at the very basic minimum level, and tweaked to be more flexible. Very little is actually common, then, between all variants, and Chrysler can have a true role and contribution - even before its work in designing the actual pieces such as engines and suspensions.

The model line
Chrysler and Dodge will indeed be differentiated more, even though the LX series has very similar Dodge and Chrysler models. Dan Minick wrote, "If you took a hard look at the future, there are NO clones between divisions. None." The days of the Reliant/Aries/LeBaron are thankfully over. There will not be any Chrysler economy cars.

Chrysler did well for a time with a large variety of models from a few basic platforms: in the 1960s and 1970s with the A and B bodies contributing most sales, in the 1980s with the K and L. However, in the 1990s, the excesses of the K-car days were countered with a worse excess - having only a single style of each platform, an expensive waste. The Neon had a single basic engine with one cam or two (second generation had two variations of a single-cam engine), and two doors or four (second generation only had four). The LH series was always a four-door sedan, admittedly with a variety of wheelbases, tuning, and trim lines. The JA and JR were four door sedans with a single convertible. Meanwhile, everyone else seemed to have a choice of door count and wagon/hatchback style.

Chrysler is returning to the plethora system, with each platform spawning a crossover/SUV style vehicle, sedan, wagon, and coupe. That can only increase sales, and at moderate extra cost. The LX series will be spread out over more models, most of them going to Chrysler; the small and medium cars will spread out across Dodge and Mitsubishi.

On going problems
Most ongoing problems are bad management, coming from a mindset that assumes all decisions are best made at the highest possible level.

Lack of involvement and empowerment of lower-end workers reduces quality and innovation, and prevents sensible cost reduction
Cost reduction efforts have become obvious in the cars
Trust of employees and, in some cases, suppliers and customers was destroyed and no effort seems to be made to build it back up
Nobody seems to have been told the new strategy, vision, and mission of Chrysler
Quality is by flying squad and management decree, with no effort to duplicate Toyota's successful ground-up system (adapted and adopted by Chrysler with great success) - the two methods are by no means incompatible
Mushroom management
First reaction seems to always be layoffs at Chrysler, more investment at Mercedes
Ax is still hanging over several plants, which surely is affecting productivity and the retention of qualified employees, not to mention increasing stress for employees and simply being a bad thing to do
Marketing and advertising is horrible (but may change with new management)
Stuttgart headquarters is still making too many decisions
Perception that arguing with a German manager leads to being fired - this can't help decision quality or innovation
The idea among managers and leaders that those who are currently acting to sabotage the union of DCX (or those who would at least prefer for it to go away) should be fired, ignored, etc., instead of considering them as potential change leaders
PlymouthThe continued absence of Plymouth seems largely due to Stuttgart's desire to save money and concentrate their effort on a manageable number of brands - and their lack of understanding of the American car market. However, as Chrysler veers far away from their current model line and styling, and specializes their brands' images more, the argument for Plymouth only increases - especially to those who remember the pre-war Airflow disaster.

Consider the current lines:

smart - ultramodern city car
Mitsubishi - sporty, youth-oriented
Dodge - muscular, prototypical American, brash
Chrysler - entry-level luxury
Mercedes - luxury
Maybach - personalized luxury
Now, consider Plymouth's role as the affordable, reliable transportation provider. No, it's not exciting, and it won't get a lot of 18 year olds, but it reaps reliable sales every year, not unlike the Corolla. Given a good, focused, low-intensity ad campaign and a small number of models, Plymouth could make an incredible comeback with attractive, PT-style cars (with those 1940s Plymouth noses). It could have a version of the Dodge minivan, with conservative styling, in case the new look of the Caravan turns off mainstream buyers and leaves Dodge with a 5% market share. It could bring back returning Plymouth buyers - there were 250,000 Plymouths sold in its last year! (That's more than some standalone car companies.) It could also rid Chrysler of its sole remaining low-priced vehicle without sacrificing the rather high sales volume of the PT Cruiser - and, yes, that was Plymouth Truck, not Personal Transportation. If the only thing standing in the way of Plymouth's return is stubborness and refusal to admit a mistake, someone is doing themselves and their employer a great disservice.

It may well be that DCX will try to shove in smart as a Plymouth replacement. However, in the American market, size is important, and smart is small. Attempting to sell a smart minivan may simply confuse customers.

Either way, we don't expect a Plymouth revival for at least four years.

Strengths of various divisionsThis is based on Dan Minick's comments, but with additions, so don't blame him if you disagree with it.

Chrysler Mitsubishi Daimler-Benz
Platform team concept Small cars Huge R&D program - much more invested than Chrysler
Purchasing skills Grasp of youth market in USA Telematics
Minivans Rallying Corporate structure
Jeep New platform designs Ability to build on high-end brand heritage
Trucks for North America Strong Asian presence Commercial vehicles
Liberty Group innovations Worldwide network
Advanced internal computer systems
Flexible, fast internal systems
Low-cost manufacturing skills
Quality enhancement systems
ConclusionDaimlerChrysler is headed into tough times, and it still makes many decisions badly. The corporation has a bloated division in Mercedes, which has managed to lose money despite its high status, thanks partly to a steep decline in quality, and it tries to solve that problem with frequent, trust-eroding, productivity-killing layoffs at Chrysler. There don't seem to be any healthy DCX divisions, with Freightliner on the edge, Mitsubishi recovering, Chrysler floundering from bad marketing, PR, and management, smart still on an investment cycle, Mercedes apparently losing money and glamor, and other properties suffering from the economy and commercial-vehicle glut.

DaimlerChrysler's savior may well be Chrysler, even as the PR folk, executives, analysists, and apologists tell us that Mercedes is saving Chrysler. For it is Chrysler's product development system which is being adopted by Mercedes; Chrysler's computer systems which are being spread across the corporation; Chrysler's unified-company philosophy; and Chrysler's supplier partnerships. If only Chrysler would get some decent marketing and the Stuttgart (and Auburn Hills) brass could wrap their heads around the importance of employees and a healthy organizational culture, Chrysler could probably make some heads turn.

skeener
Dodge Dakota
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6/26/2003
20:11:39

RE: 2004 Dakotas
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I know next year thaey are making a SRT-8 which is like a Durango with a supercharged 5.7 Hemi so you could probably expect to find a dakota SRT come out soon

fubu 05
Dodge Dakota
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6/27/2003
17:12:47

RE: 2004 Dakotas
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what ive heard is that the dakota and durango are going to have a body change for 2004 and that the 5.9 is going to be dropped completely and replaced with the 5.7 along with other engine options. i also heard talk that the dakota r/t will have an optional 6 speed transmission the t-56. there was a lotta talk concerning the 5.7 in the 2500 and 1500 rams from chrysler all this talk did come true most said it was just talk, sooo i guess we will have to if its talk concerning the dakotas and durangos. i would like to think its going to happen cause i wanna get my paws on a hemi dak 6spd.

Demon Dakota
DakotaEnthusiast

6/28/2003
18:47:21

RE: 2004 Dakotas
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skeener, the SRT-8 is a car (well, a wagon, actually).

[img]http://mywebpages.comcast.net/jrempe/SRT8.jpg[/img]

K&N Drop in AF (CAI during summer months)
True Dual exhaust and removed third cat
HO Cams & HO Intake
FASTMAN 70mm TB
Autolite 3923 Plugs
TPS @ .76 VDC
IAT Adjuster Mod
14.52@94.2 MPH at Silver Dollar Raceway

Demon Dakota
DakotaEnthusiast

6/28/2003
18:48:17

RE: 2004 Dakotas
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Awww crap...keep forgetting which forums I can do that in and which ones I can't.

K&N Drop in AF (CAI during summer months)
True Dual exhaust and removed third cat
HO Cams & HO Intake
FASTMAN 70mm TB
Autolite 3923 Plugs
TPS @ .76 VDC
IAT Adjuster Mod
14.52@94.2 MPH at Silver Dollar Raceway

chud
Dodge Dakota
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6/28/2003
22:42:23

RE: 2004 Dakotas
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I was told that the instrument cluster in the 04 dakota's was being changed to an ugly white panel as in the current intrepid's and ram's. yuk yuk yuk. What an eye sore every time you look down. I know chrysler will save some money doing this but I like the look of the all black instrument panel the way they are.

P 1

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