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Jeff Bowman
Dodge Dakota
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8/06/2002
13:27:57
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 Subject: V8 Using Oil - Dealer says NORMAL?!?!
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My 98 Dakota 5.2 4x4 CC 56000 Miles is using about 1 quart per 1000 Miles. The dealer has already replaced the Intake Gasket but it is still using about the same amount of oil. I have had friends that were following me say they notice a bit of blue smoke at heavy accelleration, so I am assuming it must be valve guide seals or something else... ANYHOW the kicker is, I have an extended warranty, so I took the truck back to the dealer. After they rechecked the intake they told me that Dodge says that 1qt/1000Mi is normal!? This seems a little exceccive to me. My question is, Has anyone else heard of Dodge saying this is normal? and if yes, do you agree with that statement or is there somewhere I should call to argue this statement...
Thanks!!
Jeff
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yates-in-DE
GenIII
8/06/2002
13:43:43
| RE: V8 Using Oil - Dealer says NORMAL?!?!
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Jeff,
Take this anyway you want, but if my truck used 1 qt per 5,000 miles when it has 100,000 miles on it I would be looking at a dealer or mechanic to rebuild it. The dealer is blowing smoke himself and I think you are the recipient. If any smoke comes out during hard excelleration except blackish/grey (heavy fuel) then it's blue and is oil and this is not right.
I have run Mazda RX7's since 1981 and they have oil injected straight into the intake manifold from the factory and if one of these uses 1 qt per 1,000 miles it needs rebuilt like really bad.
Typically these engines only use a quart every 4,000 miles with 2 oil lines feeding right into the intake manifold.
SO, if your Dakota goes through a Quart every 1,000 miles and you have the extended warranty, walk into the dealer ship with $50 in your hand to cover the deductible and tell them to make it right.
Good Luck,
My VW Killer
Lynn
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Tinybaum
Dodge Dakota
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8/06/2002
18:15:54
| RE: V8 Using Oil - Dealer says NORMAL?!?!
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I have a 98 RC 5.2 4x4 With 85,000 on it and I only use about a quart every 4000-5000. Take it to another dealer and get it checked.
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Bob W
GenIII
8/06/2002
20:48:24
|  RE: V8 Using Oil - Dealer says NORMAL?!?!
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No way is that ok. I have only put in 1/2 quart in 10,000 mi. changed the oil to syn at 5,000 will change it at again 12,500.
Gibson headers, Gibson Cat-back, Edelbrock IAS shocks, K & N drop in, 180 stat, Jet stage II chip, ARE Lid
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sandman
Dodge Dakota
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8/06/2002
22:41:00
|  RE: V8 Using Oil - Dealer says NORMAL?!?!
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While I agree that it is not right of them you tell you this it is close to an industry standard amoung DC, GM, Ford, and AC/Delco. THe standard varies a little from company to company but it is close to 1 quart per 1000 miles. Have them perform an oil usage test. If you have to bend the rules a bit so be it. Dureing the test you can easily siphon oil up through the indicator tube to show usage outside of 1 quart per 1000 miles. It is sad to say but the cards are stacked against the consumer. All warranty standards are pi$$ poor. They are basicly saying that you should take 12 quarts of oil with you if you decide to drive from Michigan to Florida????? Does that sound reasonable to you. I have a 16 year old Toyota and it use's 1 quart of conventional oil every 6000 miles it drives 80 miles a day at 30-90 MPH. If I run full synthetic it does not burn any oil per 6000 miles. Not only is oil usage a problem but a static wet/dry leak down test should be done and a differiential pressure test as well.
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HSKR
Dodge Dakota
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8/07/2002
13:07:10
| RE: V8 Using Oil - Dealer says NORMAL?!?!
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I too had the problem of buring 1 qt every 1000 miles. Dealer didn't say it was "normal", but said it was "within" standards and there is nothing they could do for warranty on it. Ended up replacing heads/cam just because I wanted to and am now down to 1 qt every 3K miles. BTW, I have 114K miles on my truck.
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Tim CH
R/T
8/09/2002
07:20:55
| RE: V8 Using Oil - Dealer says NORMAL?!?!
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Unfortunately I currently need over 1 Liter oil every 1000kms!
This definitely is way too much. In one month from now my used car warranty will execute. What can be the reason for that excessive oil consumption?
As far as I noticed there is no blue smoke, no oil leaks, nothing visible.
Is it caused by worn piston rings?
Tim
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Jeff Bowman
Dodge Dakota
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8/09/2002
10:03:41
| RE: V8 Using Oil - Dealer says NORMAL?!?!
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Well origionally the dealer thought it was an intake manifold gasket, they replaced it and it seemed to help some... but not a lot... But it would be worth at least checking first. My other mechanic buddy is suggesting it could be valve stem seals...(which would explain the other guy that replaced his heads and had no further problem)
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Sitedrifter
Dodge Dakota
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8/10/2002
10:23:59
|  RE: V8 Using Oil - Dealer says NORMAL?!?!
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Sandman is correct. Each manufacturer has a set of specifications for each engine type for oil consumption. When I worked as a mechanic the GM specs for a Chevy 350 (86-93) in the Caprice (police package) was 500 miles per quart of oil consumption was tolerable. It was not because of the car but the engine as the specs were the same for blazers and suburbans.
Talk to the service manager and ask for those specifications in writing. If they are below 1000 miles then there is nothing you can do.(I bet they are) Sorry..
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yates-in-DE
GenIII
8/10/2002
10:40:18
| RE: V8 Using Oil - Dealer says NORMAL?!?!
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Since I buy an auto to last at least 100,000 miles, I would not drive it until someone a DODGE said to replace or rebuild it.
I had a NISSAN Quest Mini Van and it started using a lot of oil, like 1 quart every 2000 miles. I took it to the dealer and they said 'IT WAS WITHIN TOLERANCE'. I took it home and stewed for about 3 days and took it back and explained that if rebuild or replacement didn't happen real soon that I would never purchase another and that I could generate negitive publisity for NISSAN as well as anyone. They made me an appointment for the next week to replace the Engine 3.0 V-6. NUFF SAID.
Later,
My VW Killer
Lynn
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Mopar Man
Dodge Dakota
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8/10/2002
12:45:52
|  RE: V8 Using Oil - Dealer says NORMAL?!?!
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I have a 1998 Dodge Dakota 5.2L (318). I have my oil changed regularly and never suspected a thing. One day as I came to a toll (Ain't Chicago great?) the check gauges indicator came on, then went back off. When I got home, I went through the truck and found that it was 2 quarts low with 2200 miles since my last oil change. The truck had under 20,000 miles at the time! I went to Dodge and they gave my the "normal usage" crap. I insisted they conduct an oil consumption test.
When I returned for the results, after 1000 miles, they told me that there was a "Service Bulletin" issued for faulty intake gaskets. They ran a quick test by removing a vacuum hose (forgive my ignorance) and a piece of paper was then put on the open oil filler on the valve cover. They said the paper should blow. My engine almost sucked the paper in. They told me the test failed. They kept the truck, replaced the gasket and the valve seals (at least, that's what they said) and the problem was gone. Personally, I still think it's a little excessive but I am about 1/2 a quart down when the oil is changed at 3000 mile intervals. I can live with that!
Another thing. Every Chrysler zone office has a "Warranty Administrator". If you can't get satisfaction from your dealership tell them that you are going the make waves at the zone office with the "W.A.". If that doesn't help, prove it's not a threat, DO IT! He has enough weight that he can actually demand a new truck for a customer,if he feels it's warranted. Just remember, be polite and get him on YOUR side.
Good Luck,
Jim
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jack
Dodge Dakota
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8/10/2002
20:39:49
| RE: V8 Using Oil - Dealer says NORMAL?!?!
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Had same proiblem on my 97 with my 5.3. Posted the problemhere and got an answer in 20 minutes. You probably have a bad Plenum gasket(belly pan). This is the plate that covers the bottom of the intake manifold. Look inside the throttle body with a flashlight. See if the bottom of the intake is wet. Next, pull the PCV valve out and take the hose from the breather element on the other side and disconnect it from the air intake. With the engine running plug both holes, you should develop some pressure in a few seconds. If you get suction it's another indicator. Some other indications are pinging on moderate to hard acceleration or even trying to pass on the interstate. Burning that much oil is not normal. I went from 1qt every 500 miles to nothing during the normal oil change interval. There is a post here that has detailed instructions but I couldn't find it. Maybe someone else knows where it is. REplaceing the gasket probably took me about 4 hours but I worked slow and deliberate running taps through every set of threads. Good luck.
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plenum man
Dodge Dakota
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10/31/2002
00:03:11
| RE: V8 Using Oil - Dealer says NORMAL?!?!
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2 little words, PLENUM GASKET. goes on the bottom of the intake, and lets oil go into the air as it passes the throttle body. your dealer knows about it, but dodge doesn't want to put 3-4 hours into replacing it. good luck.
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Scramble
Dodge Dakota
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10/31/2002
07:36:39
| RE: V8 Using Oil - Dealer says NORMAL?!?!
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Normal dude. Don't worry. My Dak has 23k and has always blown blue smoke out the back since day one. The dealer says that this is due to the fact that the 4.7L is a high output engine.
Don't worry about it. My dealer says it's ok.
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91DakotaFreak
Dodge Dakota
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10/31/2002
08:24:53
| RE: V8 Using Oil - Dealer says NORMAL?!?!
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I have a 91 dak with the 5.2L and have 98,000mi on it and it doesnt burn a drop of oil. as a matter of fact i changed it about 500mi ago and it still looks new.
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Tim CH
R/T
10/31/2002
11:01:42
| RE: V8 Using Oil - Dealer says NORMAL?!?!
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I will get my valve guide seals replaced next week after I needed 3-4 liters per 1000km on the German Autobahn! Additionally I will let them change the intake gasket after all I read here.
Hopefully this will help.
Tim
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Mike Eidson
Dodge Dakota
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11/11/2002
19:26:07
|  RE: V8 Using Oil - Dealer says NORMAL?!?!
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Mopar Man - How do you find out who the Warranty Administrator is and how do you get in contact with him? We have had numerous problems with our 99 Dakota (which we bought new) with only 19,000 miles on it and now it has a leaking intake gasket . . . Thanks!
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Mopar Man
Dodge Dakota
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11/13/2002
21:26:54
| RE: V8 Using Oil - Dealer says NORMAL?!?!
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There is a service bulletin telling dealers about defective intake gaskets. My suggestion is to find a different dealership. If that is not an option, tell the service manager that you want a meeting with the district rep. Explain the problem to him. If he won't help, he can give you the Warranty Administrators name and number. If you still can't get satisfaction, it's time to call the State Attorney Generals office.
It's one thing if a dealer gives you a hard time about an unknown problem, but it is inconceivable that a reputable dealer wouldn't handle your complaint. What state are you in, maybe I can get a name for you. Let me know how you make out!
Jim
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Mike Eidson
Dodge Dakota
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11/13/2002
22:08:28
| RE: V8 Using Oil - Dealer says NORMAL?!?!
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Mopar Man: Dodge fixed the intake gasket (minus $50). I bought the truck new. It has 19,000 miles on it. It had to be repainted immediately and since then it has required a new water pump, fuel pump, 2 thermostats, injectors, and now the intake gasket. I have asked Chrysler to give me an extended warranty on the truck because I'm afraid I will continue to have problems and the engine may be damaged (it only had 2 1/2 quarts of oil in it). They have not replied. I am in Missouri. If I don't get satisfaction, I am pursuing a Lemon Law claim. Do you know if anyone has been successful taking that route?
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Dan Gruber
GenIII
11/13/2002
22:30:55
| RE: V8 Using Oil - Dealer says NORMAL?!?!
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Lemon laws vary from state to state, but the general rule is 3 repairs for the same problem within a specified period of time. Multiple problems that are fixed and do not reoccur are not covered under lemon laws. Theoretically, your truck could require replacement of every last nut and bolt twice and it would not be considered a lemon.
And on the oil consumption issue...blue smoke coming out of the tailpipe (regardless of the root problem) could be considered an emissions problem. I'd be curious to see if a truck burning 1 qt per 1000 miles with blue smoke out the tailpipe would pass an emissions test. That might be another approach...if the truck fails a sniffer emissions test the dealer would have to fix it.
Dan
2000 CC SLT 4.7 4X4 Auto 3.92 LSD
3 inch Performance Accesories lift & 32 inch BFG MT KM's
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MoPar Man
Dodge Dakota
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11/16/2002
12:06:16
| RE: V8 Using Oil - Dealer says NORMAL?!?!
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Mike,
I don't know what the logic was behind the $50 charge. If you had the extended warranty, that's usually the co-pay. If your truck only has 19,000 miles, that service bulletin should of repaired it , free of charge.
The only problem I ever had with my 1998 Dak was oil consumption. Right in the middle of testing my Dak, Dodge came out with the Service Bulletin. My truck was fixed for free. The next oil change proved it was right, no consumption. The oil change after that, back to square one. I brought it back to my local dealer, they did the test that I stated earlier (letter above dated 8/10/2002). It failed, they replaced it again for free. The Service Manager told me that the second gasket must of had a piece of dirt on it when it was installed that prevented a good seal. Eventually, a 1/4 inch section of gasket blew out. It's been two years since and no problems.
I always buy extended warranty. My hint there is, don't buy it from a salesman when you buy the truck. They put a little in for themselves. Of course, this doesn't apply for you, so buy it from the Service Manager. They can usually give you a little better price. I'd fight for my $50 back! Good Luck!
P.S. I don't think being two quarts down will cause any lasting problems.
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Mike Eidson
Dodge Dakota
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11/16/2002
15:08:02
| RE: V8 Using Oil - Dealer says NORMAL?!?!
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The dealership has been great; it is Dodge who is not wanting to stand behind the truck. We asked them to provide an extended warranty on the truck based on its history, but they refused. Said they would sell us one from $1500-$3500! Anyway, we have decided to go the Lemon Law route. A firm has already accepted the case and will start working on it Monday. Wish us luck! The truck seems to be running fine now -- probably better than it ever has -- but we are really concerned about the future of it . . .
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jkltr
Dodge Dakota
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11/16/2002
15:13:05
| RE: V8 Using Oil - Dealer says NORMAL?!?!
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sell the truck, take what you can get for it and go buy a reliable Ford product. Goober.
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DAHEMIKOTA
Dodge Dakota
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11/16/2002
21:53:54
| RE: V8 Using Oil - Dealer says NORMAL?!?!
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jkltr,Didn't Ford (Fix Or Repair Daily)have a problem with the oil pans rusting through ?
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dakdude
Dodge Dakota
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11/16/2002
22:48:50
| RE: V8 Using Oil - Dealer says NORMAL?!?!
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check your head gaskets
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EMO
Dodge Dakota
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5/19/2003
19:13:13
| RE: V8 Using Oil - Dealer says NORMAL?!?!
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PLENUM GASKET: I have a 1999 R/T, which was using oil also. Thanks to PLENUM MAN I found my problem. I changed the gasket and oil consumption stop. The only thing is 5 months later it started again. Checked the Plenum gasket and it had blown out again. The first gasket i installed was made of paper and the second one is stamped steel. This one shouldn't blow out. So prior to replacing your plenum gasket, make sure you install the new and improver "STEEL GASKET".
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