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ricksca
Dodge Dakota
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12/15/2007
02:36:03
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 Subject: Sludge?
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Message:
I just bought a 2000 Dakota SLT w/4.7 V8. I have been reading some disturbing posts re. sludge and engine failure. I have been having a hard time determining whether this is a spotty problem or if it's pandemic. Does anyone really know how widespread this problem is??
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Phil
Dodge Dakota
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12/15/2007
06:02:20
| RE: Sludge?
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Message:
We have been talking about this for many years
Here is a great thread on this forum:
http://www.dodgedakota.net/boards/gen/8576.html
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jerrym
Dodge Dakota
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12/15/2007
08:50:31
| RE: Sludge?
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Message:
I dont worry about it, just a bad design by Dodge.
Just change your oil and filter regularly and you will be OK
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brianj
Dodge Dakota
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12/15/2007
10:39:40
| RE: Sludge?
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Message:
i did my intake gasket twice. (bought the car used)and the first time i took the manifold off there was so much sludge! man this relly shocked me so i cleaned up the oil galley as best i could and for the next 2-3 oil changes i used the gunk engine cleaner. and changed oil every 2500mi(or you can use trans fluid) and 8 months later i had to do the gasket again (dont ask) and when i took the manifold off it was clean as wistle. coildnr believe it that stuff worked so well.
so all in all, i recomend using engine cleaner one in a while and just change oil. youll be fine.
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Kowalski
GenIII
12/15/2007
14:38:42
| RE: Sludge?
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Message:
That is likely a spotty problem, and most often related to bad maintenance intervals. "brianj" - correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't you talking about a very different motor than this poster's 4.7 ? I'm guessing a 5.2 with your intake gasket problem. I know a lot of the older 5.2s would coke up bad under the intake with bad maintenance practices. Some report some gunk visible at the oil fill for the 4.7 since it doesn't get much engine heat there; but with reasonable oil change intervals with synthetic oil, I've never had it with my 8 year old 4.7. Bottom line - with good maintenance, it shouldn't be an issue.
Lead, follow, or get out of the way
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JerryM
Dodge Dakota
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12/15/2007
15:08:45
| RE: Sludge?
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Message:
Kowalski,
just curious, how many miles do you go between oil and filter changes. I use Mobil 1 full synthetic and change every 5K miles.
some think that is to conservative.
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Kowalski
GenIII
12/15/2007
15:48:29
| RE: Sludge?
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Message:
Maybe, but that's just my opinion. Doing it spring and fall is easiest for me, to avoid winter oil change (do it myself). That usually works out to a bit over 6000 with the low miles I put on; I'd be comfortable up to 7500 if I ran more miles. Same oil; too bad it doesn't sound like it's made from group 4 base anymore - but I'm not sure any of them are. Any one knows of a group 4 based API certified synthetic 5w30, be nice to know. Anyone posting as "Stan", "Detctive" or "Cory" need not reply to my querry...
Lead, follow, or get out of the way
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ya
Dodge Dakota
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12/15/2007
16:33:42
| RE: Sludge?
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Message:
Royal Purple’s motor oils are API certified and will not void new vehicle warranties.
http://www.royalpurple.com/motor-oil.html
only one I've found so far
Mobil-1 (with exception to the zero weights)and PenZ-Plat are both G3 oils
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Cory Eye_Trip
Dodge Dakota
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12/15/2007
21:42:42
| RE: Sludge?
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Message:
LEAVE ME ALONE YOU F_ING POLOCK
I KNOW I AM THE BIGGEST ARSEHOLE OF THEM ALL
I DON'T NEED YOU DISSING ME ON THIS SITE
My name is Cory (my former member name on this
website was Eye_Trip). I live in Camas Washington
and I am jealous of Amsoil.
I am the ARSEHOLE posting all the anal lube posts.
I am the ARSEHOLE posting all the Amsoil flaming.
I am the ARSEHOLE posting all the Royal Purple posts.
I am the ARSEHOLE posting all the API posts.
I am the ARSEHOLE posting and talking to myself.
I (Eye_Trip) used to be a member until my registration
was cancelled for flaming a site sponsor (Amsoil).
This is my old (Eye-Trip) profile on this site.
http://www.dodgedakota.net/cgi-bin/amb/lookup.pl?user=eyetrip
Notice my last post was 6/04/2004 14:05:17?
That is the day I was banned from posting
using my registered name.
I (Cory aka Eye_Trip) need mental counseling.
My jealousy of Amsoil has driven him insane!
My (Eye_Trip) Profile on Dakota USA
http://www.dakotausa.com/vBulletin/member.php?u=91
Date of Birth: September 29, 1967
Age: 40
Mods:2000 CC R/T, 52mm TB, , M1, 2.02 R/T heads (polished chambers), equal length headers, 3.5" exhaust, flowmaster 40 single, MP PCM, MSD ign-BTM, Taylor "409" plug wires with boots, Keith Black pistons, 5140 rods, ARP head studs, Hotchkis
Enter Gen of Dakota: III
Location: Camas Wa
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Dr Dakota
Dodge Dakota
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12/15/2007
21:44:16
| RE: Sludge?
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Message:
YO CORY!
Dr Dakota knows your engine and drivetrain.
Dr Dakota says NO ROYAL PURPLE.
RP IS NOT FOR DAKOTA or your daily driver
this was posted by Gregg earlier before the RP arsehole buried it:
Quoted from Duluth Diesel in TundraSolutions Forum.
http://www.tundrasolutions.com/forums/839369-post13/
"Not all synthetic oils are the same. Mobile is a Group III synthetic, not a Group IV. Even though the label might say Full Synthetic, it doesn't mean the same thing for all oils. As for extended drain intervals, it is fine to run extended drain intervals with a Group IV synthetic oil if you couple it with better filtration. Not all oil filters are created equal either. Fram and other cheap oil filters don't filter much below 35 micron and are just cellulose (paper based) filters. Higher quality oil filters have synthetic media, not paper, and filter much better. AMSOIL Eao oil filters filter down to 15 micron, and their bypass filtration systems filter down to 2 micron at 98% efficiency.
There are many oils out there that call themselves synthetic, but not all are created equal, and that's important to know. You do get what you pay for. Group III synthetic oils only use about 12% synthetic base stocks. The rest is hyrdocracked petroleum base stocks. For major oil companies who have their money in crude oil refining, the word "synthetic" is merely a marketing term. It does not mean 100%, but just that a percentage of synthetic base stock goes into their product.
The oils that are commonly mentioned are Group II and Group III synthetics with the exception of Royal Purple, which is a Group V. AMSOIL is a Group IV synthetic (PAO) but also uses Group V Ester technology. It gives you the best of Group IV and Group V synthetics. Mobil 1 is a Group III synthetic. AMSOIL is a Group IV synthetic.
In the late 1990s, Castrol started selling an oil made from Group III base oil and called it SynTec Full Synthetic. Mobil sued Castrol, asserting that this oil was not synthetic, but simply a highly refined petroleum oil, and therefore it was false advertising to call it synthetic. In 1999, Mobil lost their lawsuit. It was decided that the word "synthetic" was a marketing term and referred to properties, not to production methods or ingredients. Castrol continues to make SynTec out of Group III base oils, that is highly purified mineral oil with most all of the cockroach bits removed.
Shortly after Mobil lost their lawsuit, most oil companies started reformulating their synthetic oils to use Group III base stocks instead of PAOs or diester stocks as their primary component. Most of the "synthetic oil" you can buy today is actually mostly made of this highly-distilled and purified dino-juice called Group III oil. Group III base oils cost about half as much as the synthetics. By using a blend of mostly Group III oils and a smaller amount of "true" synthetics, the oil companies can produce a product that has some of the same properties as the "true" synthetics, and nearly the same cost as the Group III oil. AMSOIL differs from Group III oils. As a Group IV oil, it uses 100% pure synthetic base stocks. This is why you can run it for longer intervals.
Synthetic oils were originally designed for the purpose of having a very pure base oil with excellent properties. By starting from scratch and building up your oil molecules from little pieces, you can pretty much guarantee that every molecule in the oil is just like every other molecule, and therefore the properties are exactly what you designed in, not compromised by impurities. Synthetics were thus originally a reaction to the relatively poor refining processes available from about 1930 to about 1990. The original synthetics were designed for the Army Air Force in WW II. They simply could not make their high- performance turbo-charged radial engines stay alive on the available motor oils of the time.
One process for making synthetic base oils is to start with a chemical called an olefin, and make new molecules by attaching them to each other in long chains, hence "poly." The primary advantage of Poly-Alpha-Olefin "PAO" base oil is that all the molecules in the base oil are pretty much identical, so it's easy to get the base oil to behave exactly as you like. PAOs are called Group IV base oils.
These PAO base oils have an enormous advantage over mineral base oils in low temperature performance and in resistance to oxidation, which is critical in keeping the oil from forming acids.
Another type of base oil is made from refined and processed esters and is called Group V. Esters start life as fatty acids in plants and animals, which are then chemically combined into esters, diesters, and polyesters. Group V base stocks are the most expensive of all to produce. However, the esters are polar molecules and have very significant solvent properties - an ester base oil all by itself will do a very decent job of keeping your engine clean. So, people who are serious about making a superior oil will usually mix some Group V oils into their base stock.
Oils that are strictly Group V ester oils tend to be better suited for high RPM, hot running, air cooled engines. 100% ester based oils are usually more expensive than Group IV oils, and don't have the longevity of PAO (Group IV) or PAO/Ester mixes oils. Group V oils perform very well in the shorter term. Oils like Royal Purple and Redline are Group V oils. They perform very well in race engines and in applications where drain intervals are factory spec or shorter, whereas Group IV oils are better suited for the long haul of extended intervals.
Whatever oil you choose, know what you are buying. Just because the jug says "synthetic" doesn't mean it is made from 100% pure synthetic base stocks."
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LOL
Dodge Dakota
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12/15/2007
22:12:13
| RE: Sludge?
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Message:
looks like our little loser buddy shatto/stan is upset
he's getting kicked in the azz on steves site too
the majority of the guys over there are using royal purple too!
hey anyway Kowalski royal purple is good oil
dont buy into the bull this snake oil salesman throws on the board
I can post all the info you need proving amsoil doesnt even come close to half of what they claim
and everything or anything you need to know about royal purple
including and proving they are API certified
amsoil sent their oil in to be tested for approval
and they turned it down
amsoil had to make up a whole new oil (group 3)
just to get one API certified
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Rick
Dodge Dakota
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12/15/2007
22:38:55
| RE: Sludge?
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Message:
Geez, I thought I was making some headway, but now my head hurts. I really hadn't planned on getting a degree in organic chemistry - I just wanted to know how to keep my loser 4.7 running sludge free. But apparently I have stumbled into the middle of a donnybrook. So what's the bottom line here folks? Group 3? Group 4? Group 5? Group hug?? Mobil? Amsoil?? Will they all work? None? Is there some clarity here??? or should I buy a Nissan?
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Hi
Dodge Dakota
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12/15/2007
23:12:33
| RE: Sludge?
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Message:
Hi Rick avoid amsoil
any oil you use you want it to be API certified
you can verify that by checking your owners manual
and dont be fooled though mobil 1 is group 3
it is still a dam good oil at a good price too
and you can find it at your local walmart
they are now also carrying genuine Mopar oil filters
you could allways ad say half qt. of engine cleaner
say like Risoline or another brand
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oil guy
Dodge Dakota
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12/15/2007
23:16:42
| RE: Sludge?
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Message:
Dr Dakota = Stan = Shatto = full of sh!t
Royal Purple is API certified genuine syn oil
and warranty approved!
amsoil is NOT API certified!
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Kowalski
GenIII
12/15/2007
23:23:26
| RE: Sludge?
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Message:
Rick - your 4.7 is not a loser. But some of these posters are. Notice not one posted anything about an oil that met my criteria - going to a different brand truck will not change that...
Lead, follow, or get out of the way
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huh
Dodge Dakota
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12/16/2007
10:03:11
| RE: Sludge?
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Message:
Redline is not API
Amsoil is not API
so what !?!?!?!?!?!!
both exceed minimum API Certification
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sure
Dodge Dakota
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12/16/2007
12:15:30
| RE: Sludge?
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"Amsoil meets and exceeds API specs. "
thats why they failed API testing! LOL
your an azzhole
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brianj
Dodge Dakota
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12/16/2007
12:53:14
| RE: Sludge?
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here we go another wasted thread... with these stupid ass oil posters.
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Kowalski
GenIII
12/16/2007
13:18:39
| RE: Sludge?
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Message:
Yeah, exactly what I didn't want. As far as I know, no one is making a group 4 base synthetic anymore; that would be the best for extended service intervals. I'm not interested in group 5 base like RP that may not be good for as long.
Lead, follow, or get out of the way
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Stan
Dodge Dakota
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12/16/2007
15:46:20
| RE: Sludge?
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Message:
oil guy.
You can't fail a test you have no interest
in entering.
Neither Redline or Amsoil care about a
minimum API rating.
Cory is right!
Amsoil meets and exceeds API specs.
USE AMSOIL WITH CONFIDENCE!!!!!!!!
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Sluggo
Dodge Dakota
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12/16/2007
18:09:09
| RE: Sludge?
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Message:
Amsoil works for me!
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