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Mikey
Dodge Dakota
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12/02/2007
17:00:43
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 Subject: 2 Bad Thermostats!?
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What are the odds that I boght 2 bad thermostats in a row.
I have really bad heat in my 99, w/5.2 slt,4x4,180,000kms on it. I never really had good heat from the day I got it(about 150,000 kms. First time that I changed it I noticed that it had a 180 degree stat in there, so I figured that a 195 would be the fix. Well, even after that it was freezing in the winter(Winnipeg,Manitoba, Canada). The upper heater core hose was fairly hot and the lower one was a little cooler which I was told is normal. So, after that I figured that maybe I should get the cooling system flushed out cause maybe it was plugging up the heater core. And again I changed the thermostat to another 195, but to no avail, the heat is still awful.
The upper heater core hose is quite a bit hotter cause I can barely keep my hand on it for too long and the lower one is still cooler than the top one. But the heat is still crap.
My temperature gauge just sits right smack dab in between 55 and 100 degrees (it's about a quarter of the way), is that normal operating temp?
Is it possible to get 3 bad thermostats in a row if I buy another one or is the problem something else, like maybe a vent or flap is out of place or stuck under the dash?
I really want to get this done soon cause they are calling for the coldest winter in about 15 years. Also when I rev up the engine the air gets warm at about 2000 rpm, but that won't cut it for city driving.
PPPPPPPlllease hhhhheelllppppp mmmmeeee, I'mmmm FFFFFFrrrrrreeeeezzzinnggg tttooo ddddeeeaaatttttthhh AAAAAAHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!
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OBIO3
Dodge Dakota
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12/02/2007
19:52:14
| RE: 2 Bad Thermostats!?
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Go to the dealer and compare the ones you bought to the factory ones. Even at that, Sounds like you have plenty of hot water going to the heater. A better guess is you have a vacuum leak in the heater flaps or there wore out and your getting outside air that is by passing the heater core. think the first thing you should do is go to a shop that has a temperature checker. this will tell you if it's a circulation problem or the air flow flaps or vacuum line.
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Curly
Dodge Dakota
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12/02/2007
20:23:47
| RE: 2 Bad Thermostats!?
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For what it's worth, I tried motorads Failsafe Tstat last year. I had 3 in a row no good!
2 that locked in the open (safe) position and 1 that never opened.
Safe to say I won't be trying another one.
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Mikey
Dodge Dakota
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12/02/2007
21:06:29
| RE: 2 Bad Thermostats!?
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OBIO3,
How much work is involved in checking the vacuum lines or checking the flaps.
Do I have to disassemble everything to the point where the heater core or the whole heater/ac unit can come out, or is it just a few parts of the dash that have to come off?
I've been thinking about checking the flaps to see if anything is obstructing them, but I'm not sure how much work is involved or how long it is going to take, any idea?
Curly,
In either case of safe locked or staying open or not opening, What are the end results of each scenario as far as what will give heat and which won't?
Thanks Guys!
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daddio
Dodge Dakota
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12/02/2007
21:19:02
| RE: 2 Bad Thermostats!?
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Message:
try backflushing the heater core.
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Mikey
Dodge Dakota
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12/02/2007
22:25:53
| RE: 2 Bad Thermostats!?
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daddio,
Got that done before I installed the last thermostat. At least I think that's the same as getting a coolant system flush. But maybe it's not. Why wouldn't I see a drastic improvement after I got the system cleaned if it had to do with the heater core?
Is back flushing it a better way to clean it out?
How do I do that? Can a shop do that, cause there isn't many places I can do this myself, seeing as pretty much all outdoor water supplies are frozen at this time of the year?
Thanks
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dude
Dodge Dakota
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12/02/2007
22:40:10
| RE: 2 Bad Thermostats!?
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back flushing is 'forcing water thru the heater core in the opposite direction of the normal flow of the coolant' to hopefully flush out any debris that is stuck inside the tubes.
a 'system flush' isn't necessarely done that way,
most of the time the coolant is just drained, water is run thru the system, and then re-filled with new coolant.
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dude
Dodge Dakota
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12/02/2007
22:43:17
| RE: 2 Bad Thermostats!?
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Mikey
a thermostat that sticks open:
little heat , engine takes forever to warm up
a thermostat that sticks closed:
plenty of heat, no flow to radiator, engine overheats
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01Motorsport
Dodge Dakota
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12/04/2007
10:33:50
| RE: 2 Bad Thermostats!?
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My '01 4.7 RC 2wd was bought new, and has had annual antifreeze flushes (not drain-only). In spite of my best efforts, the radiator was "tired" at 180,000 miles and a new radiator solved the overheating. I still use the same 2-year-old Stant 180 degree thermostat, too.
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no heat
Dodge Dakota
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12/04/2007
18:03:15
|  RE: 2 Bad Thermostats!?
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I have the same problem with my 93 dakota if you figure out what the problem is please let me know
thank you
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daddio
Dodge Dakota
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12/05/2007
08:25:25
| RE: 2 Bad Thermostats!?
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again, no heat, try backflushing the heater core. it is a common problem.
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Mikey
Dodge Dakota
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12/05/2007
14:03:58
| RE: 2 Bad Thermostats!?
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Can this be done by just pouring water into the hose or do I have to use a garden hose, cause like I said, it's winter here and outside hoses are hard to come by. Could I just pour some water in there and use some compressed air to force it out, or should I find an indoor water supply and do it myself.
Any thoughts anybody?
Thanks daddio et al
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OBIO3
Dodge Dakota
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12/05/2007
22:13:49
| RE: 2 Bad Thermostats!?
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Mikey. There are a lot of vacuum hoses. It can be a disconnect or busted hose or just a crack that is near impossible to see. try hooking up a vacuum gauge to the engine to see if it's low. You just need to hunt it down. Try disconnecting the A/C and see if you get hot air. may not be cycling properly .
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dude
Dodge Dakota
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12/06/2007
02:06:26
| RE: 2 Bad Thermostats!?
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My Ram 1500 has a bad actuator motor/door,
it sometimes gets stuck between two vent
positions when turning the selector,
when that happens...the heater barely works
I've taken most of the dash appart but to fix
it would mean removing the complete heater assy.
from the cab to fix properly (including disconnecting the A/C lines)
which I'd like to avoid doing.
once in a while it un-sticks and moves,
once it does..gotta remember to "don't touch that dial!"
like OBIO3 mentionned,
quite a few things can cause heater problems
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Mikey
Dodge Dakota
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12/06/2007
02:12:19
| RE: 2 Bad Thermostats!?
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Message:
Sorry everyone, I forgot to metion that my A/C won't hold a charge because of a broken evaporator core. I'm not sure if this is important but when OBIO3 mentioned about disconnecting the A/C I thought I should mention that. I hope that doesn't change anything.
Could I just hook up the vacuum gauge to the rear of the setting control knob instead of testing it from the engine.
Also if my evaporator core is damaged bad enough could it be drawing in cold air and mix with the warm air under the dash where the A/C unit is and cause mildly warm air to come out? If I disconnect the a/c compressor clutch to stop it from turning would that help me tell if that is the problem or not?
Thanks to all,
I will also try back flushing the heater core too.
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Dan M
Dodge Dakota
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12/06/2007
06:05:11
| RE: 2 Bad Thermostats!?
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the heater core and a/c evaporator core are in the same housing.
where did you buy the t-stats from? Same parts store? same chain? Yes, it's possible to get multiple bad parts. I got 2 bad coolant temp sensors from autozone, got one from advance, no more issues.
did you test the t-stats in boiling water? did they open at the rated temp?
- Dan M
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Mikey
Dodge Dakota
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12/17/2007
13:10:01
| RE: 2 Bad Thermostats!?
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Well I'm pretty sure that everything is on the up and up, but I still can't find out what the engine temp gauge should read in the cold winters.
I compared the spring on my old 180 stat and it was way stiffer than the Motorad 192(it wasn't even a bad stat, cause I asked the guy to check 10 -15 or so and they are all way too loose. Then I went and picked up a different brand than Motorad and there 195 I could barely push open with the tips of my thumbs.
The stat change pushed my temp gauge up about 2-3 needle width(or 85-90 I suppose), although it still isn't up to 100 on the gauge, it is alot better.
What should it run at?
Anybody!!
P.S
I actually went through 4 stats before I checked the spring in the 180 and compared it. I don't think they were faulty, I think that Motorad is just CRAP!!!
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rockytoohot
Dodge Dakota
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12/22/2007
11:06:25
| RE: 2 Bad Thermostats!?
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Message:
I would try backflushing your heater core. An easy way to tell if the heater core is plugging is to grab both heater hoses with your hands when the engine is hot. They should both be close to the same temp and should be too hot to hold for very long. If one is noticeably cooler than the other try backflushing. I had to use a pressure washer to backflush mine before I started to get decent heat but it is still not great. I am going to change my heater core.
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GM Holden
Dodge Dakota
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6/08/2008
01:25:38
|  RE: 2 Bad Thermostats ?
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Message:
Hi Folks,
Just letting you know from the " Land Down Under " That I have had 2 MotoRad Thermostat's ( 180F / 82C ) in row that failed out of the packet.
They are sold here in Austalia under the TRIDON brand name.
The first 1 failed STUCK CLOSED so that was picked up on installation & no harm was done , The Auto Parts shop replaced it under warranty without a problem.
I decided to run the engine without a Thermostat as a new rebuilt motor was only 6 months away & I kept the replacement thermostat for the Rebuilt motor.
The rebuilt motor went in about 4 weeks ago & the replacement Thermostat ( MotoRad 180F ) was put in .
Did a few very short runs with the rebuilt motor , All seemed to be good & then Disaster Happened :(
On the trip to work the motor overheated badly & I stopped the car , Let it cool down & then topped up the water and made a slow trip to work.
Got it home & had a good look , The MotoRad Thermo was sticking & I removed it.
2 Weeks later ( NOW ) I finally had a look at why I'm loosing coolant.
Yep you guessed it :( , Blown Head Gasket filling # 3 Cylinder up with water.
Heat Tested the MotoRad Thermostat with a Thermocouple & ( I'm quoting temps in Celcius here ) It starts to open at 89C ( Should be 82 C ) Fully opens at 97 C ( Should be 93 C )
These Thermostats are complete Junk , Stick with OEM Stat's ( Assuming that the OEM is NOT made by MotoRad !
I'm going to try to get the supplier here in Australia ( Tridon ) to come to the party to at least pay for Head Gasket set to fix up the problem , But I'm not holding my breath :(
Potentially a $2200.00 Rebuilt 5 Litre V8 has become JUNK if it's anything more than just a blown head gasket.
These MotoRad Thermostat's are not a Cheap Item , Probably only a Dollar or 2 less than the OEM product , So I would strongly advise everyone to avoid them and stick with your OEM's !
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2000 QC
Dodge Dakota
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6/26/2008
17:09:51
| RE: 2 Bad Thermostats!?
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AZ is selling thermostats supposedly for 5.9/5.2 that physically will not open at any temp. It will install properly, but the bottom of the copper piece will interfere with the bottom of the manifold when it tries to open. Sorry, I don't remember which brand, but be sure to carefully compare with what you are taking out.
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GM Holden
Dodge Dakota
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6/26/2008
17:44:23
|  RE: 2 Bad Thermostats!?
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Just a follow up on my MotoRad thermo post.
Went out and bought a Stant thermostat of the same temperature and tested it with a thermocouple.
This was WORSE than the MotoRad unit :(
Starts to open at 89 C & is not fully open until boiling !
Oh and I was wrong about my engine damage , It wasn't a blown head gasket , Much Worse :(
A 2mm longtitudinal crack along the deck of the block between Cylinders 3 , 5 & 7 .
Getting bad thermostats is an expensive problem.
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