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Mark green 92
Dodge Dakota
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12/18/2003
16:40:59
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 Subject: RE: 92 V6 stall and back fire
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The IAC, idle air control valve, or motor, or whatever, all names for the same part is on the back of the throttle body and held on by 2 Torx screws. There is an electrical connector plugged into the back of it. I lack the ability to post pictures but if you look at Larry's current post "How to chain & tensioner" the 6th picture down shows a dial indicator checking the camshaft. It is not a necessity for the distributor, if the shaft the rotor button presses onto moves side to side, it probably needs replacement. I don't know if the distributor housing bushings are serviceable. Read a service manual on indexing the distributor before you remove your old one from the engine, the pictures should help. Lastly these are Mopar Performance part numbers and the prices came from Mancini Racing. You can get the o. e. numbers from the dealers but you shouldn’t pay more than this.
Intermediate shaft P3690715 $27.95
Bushing P1737725 $ 6.75
Check to see how much your dealer or shop wants to install them, and it wouldn’t be a bad idea to see if a Mopar friendly machine shop could do the job. Purchasing these tools for one job may be cost prohibitive.
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Eva
Dodge Dakota
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12/18/2003
16:46:13
| RE: 92 V6 stall and back fire
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Ok great!! So does the housing have to be replaced then, I assume not but I want to be sure. Do you think aftermarket parts would be a bad idea especially considering the 92's are so notorious for this type of problem?
Again thank you so much for your help and patience !!
Eva
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Mark green 92
Dodge Dakota
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12/18/2003
17:25:26
| RE: 92 V6 stall and back fire
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Some left-right movement is normal when you try to move the rotor while everything is together and still in the engine, it is clearance between the gears below the distributor. Large amounts of movement indicate a problem. I’m not convinced that the distributor is at fault, but if you can find a quality aftermarket part it would probably not be a bad idea for a cost savings. Find out if you can return it, most companies will not let you return a part once it has been installed.
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Eva
Dodge Dakota
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12/20/2003
12:49:18
| RE: 92 V6 stall and back fire
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Ok, did the tune up last night and starting is better although died once in the last four to five starts but no backfiring, hasn't died yet while driving (not even on the freeway). So it's almost like back to square one for the moment, where it was a once in a while thing. It's possible that it just in a good mood, it does that once in a while too. Going to change the fuel filter tonight and will give a better update on Monday.
Eva
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Eva
Dodge Dakota
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1/02/2004
12:47:35
| RE: 92 V6 stall and back fire
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Ok, replaced the pick up myself to no avail... did a second diagnosis with a different mechanic and he said I need the crank positioning sensor replaced and that I need a new distributer, the bushing is completely shot... so that's what I'm following next. The distributer is going to be here tomarrow if I'm lucky and monday, if I'm not.
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Mark green 92
Dodge Dakota
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1/02/2004
15:32:06
| RE: 92 V6 stall and back fire
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Crank position sensor is p/n 56026701, aprox. $75+ from a dealer, probably cheaper aftermarket. Current O.E. parts are stamped made in Mexico, you may be able to get an aftermarket one made in the U.S. When you change the distributor make sure you line up the rotor with the #1 cast into the pickup plate, it controls injector pulse. If you know anyone with the factory scan tool it is a good idea to get the distributor adjusted so the injector sync. is at 0 or + a couple of degrees, engines vary and some respond better than others.
A search on this site for injector sync should turn up more info on this subject, good luck.
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Eva
Dodge Dakota
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1/03/2004
20:12:40
| RE: 92 V6 stall and back fire
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Ok, replaced the distributer, among the tune up, pick up and crank positioning sensor. The aftermarket distributer wasn't machined properly, how do ya like that... so after getting that straight got it in and same problem anyways!!! The idle is strong at 700, no problems there... I actually had to change the distributer at a parts store due to lack of a ride and to measure the correct size for the distributer agianst the original... the conclusion was that some sensor is sending the wrong signal to the computer afecting the timing, or the computer is sending the wrong signal to something in regards to the timing at, particular times... having another guy do a follow up diagnosis on the side (should be a lot cheaper and he happens to be a wiring wiz)...
If you have any other ideas... I did ask the last guy about the TPS and he said it doesn't apply to my problem... also we were able to check the fuel pressure which was at 31... I believe it should be between 35 and 45, but don't think that is affecting my problem too significantly and certainly not soley to blame.
Looks like this is going to be one of those money sucking problems after all...Any more ideas would be great...
Thanks,
Eva
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Eva
Dodge Dakota
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1/05/2004
12:28:57
| RE: 92 V6 stall and back fire
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I did a second diagnostic yesterday, and after fiddling around with a few things, his conclusion was a weak spark... not bad but slightly weak... then after revign the engine, which was on a bad start and misfiring and backfiring, etc... he was looking at his computer thing an said that the MAP Sensor was going absolutely wacko when the the engine was reacting properly...vaccuum pressure was fine...
For another $80 I'm gonna try that next... Let me know your opinion, which I know is difficult since you can't see the truck... but have you heard of the MAP sensor going bad before? This guy said that Dodges are known for that...
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Mark green 92
Dodge Dakota
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1/05/2004
13:13:27
| RE: 92 V6 stall and back fire
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That's a tough call. Is it going crazy because it's bad or because the engine is trying to run with a problem and creating turbulence in the intake? It would have been nice to see the output it was sending to the computer. By the way AutoZone lists them for $50, might be a cost savings. I am not familiar with map sensor failures on the Dakotas, mine is original at 176k. The early minivans and fwd cars had problems with them due to condensation and their location near the engine and I believe gave all Chrysler vehicles a stigma. Your fuel pressure is normal, that rules out pressure regulator, filter, and damaged tubing. It should also eliminate your fuel pump unless there is an intermittent problem, usually they fail without warning. If it were me, also look to see if your IAC valve is original and change it for the t.s.b. O.E. part in the earlier post(originals are silver, replacements are black, compare part#s). Second chase down the wiring splice in your harness and look for corrosion (you may want to check this first) search this topic for more information. Best of all it costs only time, a little solder, and heat shrink or electrical tape. It would be nice if you had a friend's truck to share known good parts with rather than use the shotgun approach to repair. It really sounds like this is a real gremlin of a problem and 10 different mechanics will give you 10 different answers.
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Eva
Dodge Dakota
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1/05/2004
14:32:38
| RE: 92 V6 stall and back fire
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You think the fuel pump is ruled out unless this is an intermittent problem? It is intermittent... but I was under the impression that a problem with the fuel pump would not be intermittent... either it would work or it would not...
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Mark green 92
Dodge Dakota
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1/05/2004
15:07:09
| RE: 92 V6 stall and back fire
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Yes you are correct,(usually) it’s all or nothing.
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Eva
Dodge Dakota
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1/07/2004
12:12:57
| RE: 92 V6 stall and back fire
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Ok replaced the MAP sensor and the coil... this problem is clearly getting worse and I think soon I am going to end up stuck... It's starting to back fire in the engine compartment, there is a clacking or ticking sound that is getting louder each time the engine backfire happens... It actually cranked but wouldn't turn over for a while this morning... I fear the end is getting closer... I think I am going to have a heart attack.
I have tried to look for this wire that you say corrodes in the wiring harness, red and white I believe you said... Can't find it anywhere... you said it goes about a foot down, is it drivers or passengers side? And where does it come from?
Help
Eva
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Eva
Dodge Dakota
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1/07/2004
13:06:40
| RE: 92 V6 stall and back fire
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Question, what do you know about the computer relearning? For example replaceing the map sensor... I was just told to disconnect the neg terminal (duh) and then drive for at least 10 miles so the computer can relearn driving conditions... do you know anything about that?
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Mark green 92
Dodge Dakota
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1/07/2004
13:31:40
| RE: 92 V6 stall and back fire
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Computer relearning is just what you stated, disconnect the battery wait a while and or turn on something tike the lights to drain any current in capacitors the reconnect and drive. I don't have the exact procedure in front of me but typically a couple of trips that allow the engine to come up to normal operating temperature usual do it. As far as the wiring, this red with white stripe wire comes from your fuse/ relay box on the driver's fender headed towards the cab. I did this last year and found mine to be ok so I am trying to recall it from memory. You have to carefully unwrap/ untape the harness for about one foot and all the wires are red/white and the splice is wrapped in that cloth gauze. You can probably meter the disconnected positive terminal and the power pin to the computer, I forget the pin # and if you get more than.1 or .2 ohms this splice should be repaired. There have been several good posts on these subjects, searching them may give you some additional information. On the bright side, when it fails and is no longer intermittent it gets easier to diagnose.
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Eva
Dodge Dakota
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1/07/2004
13:45:01
| RE: 92 V6 stall and back fire
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no kidding..
The guy that did the free diagnosis, is very curoius about looking at it again, however he has just come down with pneumonia... and then there's always the I don't want it to die!! part, lol... I'll keep ya posted
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Eva
Dodge Dakota
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1/07/2004
16:35:55
| RE: 92 V6 stall and back fire
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Do you know of anyone in the sf bay area that you could recommend? I'm starting to get desparate...
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Mark green 92
Dodge Dakota
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1/07/2004
21:58:45
| RE: 92 V6 stall and back fire
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Being on the east coast my sources are limited. However I hate to play ping pong referrals but I have purchaced parts from Sam Parthemer at performanceparts@cox.net , but he is in San Diego. Maybe he has some contacts in your area,it's worth a try.
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Mark green 92
Dodge Dakota
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1/08/2004
20:48:03
| RE: 92 V6 stall and back fire
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While searching for some technical info I came across something else to check based on the symptoms. Can you rent or borrow a vacuum pump with a gauge? Early magnums have an EGR valve located to the right of the distributor on the back of the block. This is a part that was supposed to be changed around 75K miles as a service item. If the engine exhibits rough idle, dies when returned to idle or the idle is both rough and slow the EGR valve may be leaking in the closed position. Does it sound similar? Maybe? I will not bla-bla the test procedures they are in a Haynes manual and fairly simple to test. They should be available aftermarket for $65+/-.
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Eva
Dodge Dakota
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1/09/2004
15:08:17
| RE: 92 V6 stall and back fire
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That actually sounds plausible... I will check that out. Also I found a forum where someone had a similar problem and a response stated these trucks are supposedly known for a leak at the intake, there is a pan under the intake manifold that has a gasket, it where's out creating an internal vacuum leak and can cause such problems (and oil getting into the throttle body)... however I would think that the intermittent situation might not apply... Am I correct to assuem that if I had a vacuum leak internal or external that it would be a contsant problem and not an intermittent one?
A friend of mine at a parts store thinks this gasket is a good lead, however it's funny you came up with a check on the EGR because that's what his boss has seemed to be set on from the beginning (an EGR problem). Thanks
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Mark green 92
Dodge Dakota
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1/09/2004
15:59:05
| RE: 92 V6 stall and back fire
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With the intake plenum leak it should be an all the time problem. If you hook a vacuum gauge on to the intake and have good vacuum when it's running ok and a bad vacuum signal when its running poorly it's probably not a gasket. Think about it, if the gasket is drawn away from the parts so that it leaks, how does it reseal itself under intake vacuum so that it is able to run ok again? There was a visual test to look down into the intake at the floor and look for an oily residue. This is sort of ok with a new engine but after 100K miles crankcase vapors do a pretty good job of adding an oily coating to the plenum floor especially if it never got a major cleaning from a prior service. Which is lighter, air or oil vapor, not all vapors are drawn into the intake runners. With this design intake all the runners point to the floor (where the pan is that you have heard about gasket leaks) but none are actually part of the intake floor. This design is a dry system and does not flow liquids very well.
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