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J and J Auto
GenII
 
5/03/2009
02:07:08
|
 Subject: New cam mileage
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Message:
With the stock cam and the 1.7 harlands in the
winter around 0 degree's I always got like 18 19
mpg
I only checked it twice this winter and both times
it was 20 20.5
I have aprox 2500 miles on the new cam, lifters
and double roller chain (cloyes) I let my brother
use to to go grocery shopping when we got the foot
of snow in the middle of april here his car was
stuck in his drive way LOL it was aprox 30 degrees
that day
Well I put my truck in the garage and did not use
it until today, drove it to a friends house put
about 80 miles more on it around 50 degrees out
ram air on.
pulled into the mobil station 124 miles and it
took 5.2 gals 23.8 mpg
At first it seamed to use more gas with the hotter
cam but now that it has some miles on it and the
chain has losenend up its better than stock
The cam has the same lift and at .050 is
196 205
you can add about 4 degrees to that using the 1.7
ratio roller rockers so more like 200 210 same
lift as stock
23.8 in 50 degree weather I would say 25 mpg in
70 80 degree weather is there maybe even 26mpg
and this is a 4x4 with all the mods and bolt ons
e3 spark plugs
The cam has added power everywhere and when you
hit 3000rpm it has a very big power gain over
stock
Now why did all these after market cams increase
the lift so much that you need to change the
springs that is not nessasary adding just 10
degrees to the intake side and 12 to the exhaust
and maintaining the same lift makes a nice
improvement
SLP-KC-1502 cam and lifter kit $264
SLP-CS-1502 cam only $160
It is listed for the 92 93 3.9 but will work in
any 3.9 92 thru 03
However I did get the last one they had at the
time so you would have to call summit
1-800-230-3030 get the tech dept and ask for the
sealed power fedral mogal tech number and call
and see if they have made more they said they were
going to
A very good price for a better cam and no
expensive spring change needed use a good cloyes
double roller and the tensioner which summit also
carries
This cam provides a nice improvement in power at
crusing speed runs excellent with the 1.7 ratio
roller rockers you could use the stock 1.6 ratio
also and get a nice improvement
If you plan on changing the cam this is the best
way to go
If you go with a KRC or Hughes cam your looking
at over a $1000
Just put the nubers in the search at summitracing
.com they are still selling them
cant wait for the nice weather to get here and see
what she will pull for gas mileage
Larry
J&J Auto
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wadak
GenIII
5/09/2009
23:06:53
| RE: New cam mileage
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Message:
Good to heat that the power is holding up and the mileage also. Are you running the stock pcm with the Jet chip or a performance pcm?
Wadak
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harry frum ct
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
5/10/2009
21:33:03
| RE: New cam mileage
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Message:
i did the cam and i have a jet chip....im getting 25.5 on a trip and 22.00 in town...i have a lot of hills in my town of litchfield ct
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harry frum ct
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
5/10/2009
21:34:45
| RE: New cam mileage
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Message:
oh i have a 2001 ..2 wheel drive ..drasticly lightened.....took off 839 lbs
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J and J Auto
GenII
5/12/2009
03:07:12
| RE: New cam mileage
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Message:
stock computer with a jet 2 chip
I just filed it up today lots of back road driving
and it was 23.4 mpg with a little hot roding in
there
When I hit second at light throttle it shifts
at 30 mph to 3rd any time before 30 mph you can
hit the throttle and at 3000rpm man is she nice
With the sock cam I would get a drone sound around
2000rpm and a hummer at 3000 and up with the
hotter cam no drone and at 3000rpm on up you can
hear the diff plan as day the cyls are more
seporated and it raps a lot more, the power diff
from 3000 on up is so noticeable you would have to
be dead from the neck up not to notice it very
nice
Harry Excellent job on your truck when you hit
that kind of gas mileage you know your running
perfict or as close as you can get to perfict
Ill bet you also have a lot more power there
over the stock configuration
A lot of people say the mods don't work that is
just not true when I hear people getting worse
performance from doing the mods I know dam well
they have some issues with there trucks
As I have said many times all my V6 dak customers
are enjoying 20 plus mpg I have 1 guy who with
his 2 wheel short bed who has hit 27mpg a number
of times 24 25mpg all the time
I have yet to take a nice high way trip in nice
weather to see what I can pull but I also have
the problem with my right foot being to heavy
The sound and the power is very hard to resist
especialy in second above 3000rpm I just love it
shifting at 5000rpm you see I have no rev limiter
on my truck
Whay back when they were still flashing the obd1
systems I had the rev limiter removed and the
lockup shift set to 50 not 45mph I am also running
87 oct fuel with no ping all the mods and bolt
on's with the hotter cam and there is a 127,000
on the motor it is starting to use a little oil
at 5 to 6000 miles when I change oil its always
down 1/4 to 1/2 Qt but I do get on it very often
Larry
J&J Auto
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bumity bump
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
5/22/2009
00:31:52
| RE: New cam mileage
IP: Logged
Message:
bumity bump
|
Wadak
GenIII
6/05/2009
17:46:40
| RE: New cam mileage
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Message:
Larry,
Any mileage updates?
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harry from ct
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
6/05/2009
23:06:06
| RE: New cam mileage
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Message:
I change my oil at 3000 and i use mobil 1 syn....I also flashed my puter and still use the Jet II...I brainstormed with other friends and i dont think we can do another thing to make more mileage....ps i also have a stock 2001 3.9 puter forsale......100 dollars shipping free contact me @ works2long@yahoo.com
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Behaley
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
6/11/2009
21:35:49
| RE: New cam mileage
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Message:
I am new to the site. I have been following this cam and engine mod stuff here for a while. I am rebuilding the entire drivetrain of a 92 v6 4x4 dak.
I have some bad news on the 1502 cam from fedral mogal. I called Summit Racing and then fedral mogal. Summit is out of stock on the 1502 cam, and fedral mogal is not longer going to produce it. When fedral mogal pulled the 1502 part number, their computer say it is superseded by the 1559.
I may have run across one from Checker Auto, but I can't verify it. Their computer and the invoice calls it a KC-1502 from sealed power, but what showed up is an Engine Pro MC856 with a smaller number of MC1253. I can't find any information about what this truly is. The other bad news--the kit cost $435+ tax.
Does anyone else have any new information???
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harry from ct
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
6/11/2009
22:12:41
| RE: New cam mileage
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Message:
sorry the are almost out of business like all the other suppiers....were in a depression not a ression.........xcuseme for my diction ... we lost all our jobs here...good luck pal
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Bumper
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
6/25/2009
21:18:19
| RE: New cam mileage
IP: Logged
Message:
bump
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J and J Auto
GenII
6/30/2009
02:49:59
| RE: New cam mileage
IP: Logged
Message:
That sucks
The only other cam that is close is the hughes
engines cam for more towing power but you would
need to change the valve springs
Mileage combined highway back roads and a little
hot rodding. I also put my open air cleaner top
on with the scoop for summer and my last check
was 24.4 I would say on a straight highway trip
25 26 mpg should be there it just purs injector
sync at +6
When I got the 1502 fed said its an active number
and they would make more I guess the resesion
changed there mind and at that time they had 1
out in calf that I got from there warehouse
check like rock auto and others they may have one
sitting on the shelf
To me that is just a shame such a nice cam just
perfict and no expensive spring change.
Another option would be to have one ground
196/205 .270 112 center line same lift as stock
just more duration
I would like to get to more posts but its like
15 to 2 am and I am very tired have to go hit
the pillows
Larry
J&J Auto
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Behaley
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
12/30/2009
15:12:19
| RE: New cam mileage
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Message:
I found the specifications on the MC1253 cam. It is a Melling Cam. This what Checker/ORielly/Schucks and Autozone, and some others stores sell as a stock replacement cam for the 3.9L V6.
It appears to be something in between the Sealed Power 1502 and 1559 specs. However, the tech I talked to says this is the exact replacement for the Sealed Power #1502 cam.
They don't have crossover to the Sealed Power #1559 yet. It is currently listed in their book as "under development".
Here are the specs from their book.
@ .050 lift
Ext: opens 27 BBC, closes -14 ATC, 193 duration
Int: Opens -22 BTC, closes 26 ABC, 184 duration
SAE Specs@ (.06/rocker arm ratio) 1.6 rocker=.0375 lift
Ext: opens 58 BBC, closes 29 ATC, 267 duration
Int: opens 8 BTC, closes 66 ABC, 254 duration
CAM lift
Ext: .269
Int: .258
Gross lift
Ext: .430
Int: .413
Centerline
Ext: 110
Int: 114
The negative angles don't make any sense to me. Why not list them all the same. When comparing the two different lift height/angles, it appears that there is only .0125 lift in 30 degrees of travel. That seems wrong to me and the tech, but he couldn't give me a good answer at this time.
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Behaley
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
12/30/2009
15:40:47
| RE: New cam mileage
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Message:
Also the cost of the MC1253 is $127.99 for just the cam at Autozone. $435 through Checker/Oreilly. Guess who gets my business more often.
Completed the drivetrain rebuild. The engine has no power and terrible gas mileage. I don't know why yet. 1k miles on rebuild. I'm thinking valve timing, bad injectors, or bad ECM. I'm just guessing because everything else measures correctly.
new heads (stock, but higher quality and precision)
Harland Sharps 1.7 roller rockers, Melling roller timing chain and gear set. gasket matched intake and exhaust. Total seal rings, V8 TB, Bosh 4 hole injectors. removed the intake manifold divider and polished/deburred the intake manifold interior. no intake runner length changes. Flowmaster 40 muffler. Everything else stock.
AX-15 5spd, 3.9 LSD, 4x4.
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Bucket
GenII
12/30/2009
16:34:30
| RE: New cam mileage
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Message:
Has it been consistantly bad throughout the 1k ? and what kind of mileage we talking about?
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harr from ct
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
12/31/2009
02:52:50
| RE: New cam mileage
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you are taking a 05 site.....things are different now.......mileage is up.......hi tech
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Behaley
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
12/31/2009
13:05:34
| RE: New cam mileage
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05 thinking may be true, but is it also more expensive and harder to maintain without lots of specialized equipment. There also seems to be less maintanence oriented engineering happening, like requiring the engine to be removed to change spark plugs (Ford). This makes basic repairs expensive and time consuming. If I can get 20+ mpg and similar power and not spend 30K for a new truck and $???K maintaining it, why not?
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Behaley
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
12/31/2009
13:36:14
| RE: New cam mileage
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Message:
yes, consistently bad throughout the 1k miles. I think I may have found out why . +4 to +6 retarded cam timing. This with the stock marks properly lined up. The injector timing was set at 0 crankshaft position, which means it is probably firing a little early in the valve cycle and getting sucked out the exhaust. That would fit with the spark plugs being bright white and clean, like they were running lean. When I checked the ign timing, the computer was firing at idle at 5 degrees BTC instead of the 10 expected. After I fix this problem, we see if it makes a difference.
While checking the valve timing, I discovered a typo in the Melling cam info. The SAE specs should be at .00375, not .0375. Also the negative numbers are for adding up the duration. Just change the neg to pos and the "A" or "B" to the opposite to get more standard spec information.
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wadak
GenIII
12/31/2009
22:41:34
| RE: New cam mileage
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Message:
The Sealed Power ZCS1502 is the replacement for the 1992/1993 3.9 liter v6. The Sealed Power ZCS 1559 is the replacement for the 1993/1994 3.9 liter v6 according to www.summitracing.com.
The question I would have which cam has the greater duration the 1502 or the 1559? My guess would be the 1502, the one thats not available. Does this become an emission issue or availability issue?
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pete
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
1/03/2010
21:47:17
| RE: New cam mileage
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Is this instant mileage? Run a full tank to empty and refill and how many miles driven a 1/4 tank isn't going to give true mileage. I just don't believe a hotter cam in beginning of winter and get 24+ and hot rodding around back roads and being 4x4. I am not trying to be smarta!s but It doesn't sound true when I see the specs you give on the cam, I no engineer but more duration opening means more gas using ? agree ? or disagree ? these v-6's are not going to get 24 25 26 on tank of gas. All I get barely get 15-16 in the winter STOCK! with some of the mods you have suggested. Where I am missing the mod not properly done or what you have done ?
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Behaley
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
1/04/2010
20:17:00
| RE: New cam mileage
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Holy crap!! What a difference. I advanced the cam using the 4 degree advance mark on the crank gear. This resulted in an actual 2 degree advance over what is supposed to be straight up marks. The straight up marks actually produced a 6-8 degree retard. Not sure why, but it is what it is. With straight up marks(retarded), this truck got 14-15mpg highway, and lost when trying to pass a semi up a small hill without shifting into third. Now, with only 150 miles since the change and the computer not reset, it gives good whiplash in all but 5th. It also got 18mpg (94miles/5.2gals) with half of that being in 4 wheel drive at 40mph (The nature of Jan-Feb driving to work in my area is most roads don't get plowed and are permanently snow packed or iced over,but nobody changes anything.)
Pete
I think you have a problem. I got 15-16mpg with both heads cracked between four cylinders, all the valve seats eroded beyond recognition, and the timing chain so sloppy that it was barely touching the crank gear. With these same problems, it only dropped to 10-12mpg while trying to pull 3000lbs through high mountain passes. When I first bought it, normal mileage was 19-20mpg fully stock (no mods) with 80k miles on it, and only dropped to 14-15mpg when towing a minivan on a car trailer 1200miles (3000-7500ft altitude & 6600lbs total towed weight).
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