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Chris M
Dodge Dakota
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5/23/2008
16:26:19
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 Subject: Hard Starting
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I've got a 93 3.9. For the last two or three weeks, if the truck sits overnight or for at least a couple hours, it takes quite a bit of cranking before it starts. Or I can turn the ignition on and off several times to "prime" the system first, then it will start quicker. If I shut it off for a minimal period of time like to go in a store, it will start quickly. So I'm suspecting there is probably a check valve that is integral with the pump/float/pickup assembly that is not holding the fuel up in the system properly. I replaced the fuel pump about four years ago when it totally failed. I dread the thought of having to do that again. Since it runs perfectly fine once it starts, is there an accessary (add-on) check valve available that could be spliced into the fuel line to see if that helps?
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Chris M
Dodge Dakota
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5/23/2008
16:30:01
| RE: Hard Starting
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Oh, I forgot to ask - Does anyone know what would be considered an acceptable fuel pressure bleed-down rate if all the injectors and check valve were in good condition?
Thanks.
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jayb
Dodge Dakota
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5/23/2008
16:54:32
| RE: Hard Starting
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my 5.2 does the same thing. its no big deal. instead of turning the key right to cranking, switch to the "on" position for about 2 seconds then crank it. My truck bleeds down every night but she still starts fine every day.
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dakota49
Dodge Dakota
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5/23/2008
22:43:32
| RE: Hard Starting
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Message:
Chris, to check the fuel pressure you should have 31 pounds at idle with the vacuum hose to the pressure regulator, with the hose disconnected it should be about 39. As for bleed down, it should have at least a little pressure after you stop the engine. But as you have found, by turning the key on a few times before trying to start helps so I would do that 2-3 times before trying to start. If you do the pressure test, if it looses pressure fast when you shut off the eng. I would try replacing the fuel pressure regulator.
Good Luck
Dakota49
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J and J Auto
GenII
6/03/2008
05:12:31
| RE: Hard Starting
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Message:
carb 7psi
throttle body injection 15 to 17psi
multiport 40 minimum
when you drop below 40 gas mileage will drop
do to poor atomization
A good system will hold presser for 2 to 3 hours
at least 1 hour is ok
Larry
J&J Auto
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Chris M
Dodge Dakota
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6/03/2008
17:26:45
| RE: Hard Starting
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Multiport in my case.
I'm confident that the pump is pushing adequate pressure and flow rate, as the truck still runs good and fuel consumption hasn't changed (unfortunately). It's just the long cranking required when it's been sitting for a while, like overnight or when I've been at work all day. It takes about 5 or 6 seconds of cranking for the engine to fire up. It used to fire up by cranking it about one revolution or less. Am I correct in assuming that there IS a check valve involved somewhere in the pump/sender assembly? Thanks.
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daddio
Dodge Dakota
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6/03/2008
20:01:51
| RE: Hard Starting
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Message:
Chris, you are correct. there is a check valve in the pump/sending unit. in the morning try cycling the key to on/off 2 or 3 times to prime the system and it should start right up. just turning the key to on and waiting a few seconds won't do it as the pump will only run for a couple of seconds if the PCM doesn't get a signal that the engine is fired up.
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Chris M
Dodge Dakota
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6/04/2008
11:19:42
| RE: Hard Starting
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Message:
That's exactly what I've been doing. If I prime it about 3 times, with a couple seconds between each shot to push the air out of the fuel rail, it will cut the cranking down to 1/2 or even less. I just don't like the thought of having to live with it this way. But nor do I like the idea of having to dig into the tank to fix it. That's why in my original post I asked if anyone knew of some sort of aftermarket check valve that I could put in-line somewhere between the tank and the engine. Thanks for the response.
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daddio
Dodge Dakota
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6/04/2008
11:35:47
| RE: Hard Starting
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the inline check is a great idea that i've never seen anyone suggest before on here. shouldn't be too hard to find an inline check that will fit in the full line. then find a good place to install it. what may be easier to find is an inline filter with a built-in check valve.
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Chris M
Dodge Dakota
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6/05/2008
16:01:36
| RE: Hard Starting
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"...what may be easier to find is an inline filter with a built-in check valve..."
I like that idea. I'll explore it. Thanks.
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daddio
Dodge Dakota
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6/05/2008
16:49:31
| RE: Hard Starting
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Chris M, post back if you find something. i am sure there are others here that would like to try that to solve the same problem.
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J and J Auto
GenII
6/05/2008
22:17:00
| RE: Hard Starting
IP: Logged
Message:
Heres what you can try
in the power dist box under hood swap out the
relays from like the A/C to the fuel pump if still
the same than yes a leaky check valve
the only way to fix that is to replace the pump
get a master it comes with new pump, filter,
check valve and guage sender around $200 to $250
the carter is what is used from factory or a
holley
Larry
J&J Auto
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Chris M
Dodge Dakota
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6/06/2008
20:38:36
| RE: Hard Starting
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Message:
Larry,
If you are suggesting I swap relays to make sure the pump is getting power and cycles on with the ignition, it's not necessary - I can hear the pump run for a couple seconds when I turn the key to ignition. If I cycle the ignition on and off about 3 or 4 times before cranking the starter it will fire up pretty quick once i DO hit the starter.
BTW - The truck is on its second pump/sender assembly which I had to install about 4 years ago when the pump totally failed. I istalled a Carter which was an exact clone of the OEM. It was only about $125 at the time from Advance auto. They're a lot more now. I just think it sucks that you have to drop the tank or lift the bed to access the stupid thing. In comparison, when my wife's Volvo fuel pump failed, I simply opened the trunk, unsrewed an access panel, and I was staring the top of the sender unit in the face. But with the Dakota, like so many U.S. built cars, it wasn't designed to maintain. Oh well, so be it.
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jayb
Dodge Dakota
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6/09/2008
19:45:21
| RE: Hard Starting
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Message:
"But with the Dakota, like so many U.S. built cars, it wasn't designed to maintain. Oh well, so be it."
I dont see how a fuel pump setup could be different in a truck. if you had the pump on the side, or bottom you would probably get gas all over the place, and it would have to take a 90' turn down, probably making it a pain to remove anyways. one good way to do it, is make a little door in the bed over the pump itself. my grandfather did that. probably what ill do too.
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