| From | Message |
Doug
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
8/10/2005
17:53:47
|
 Subject: RE: V8 Throttle Body Swap
IP: Logged
Message:
Yes, I do have a cam, head job, etc in mind, but right now, I am trying to complete the manifold. I was thinking about going to 19# injectors as well, but for right now most of the liberated air is going to be wasted. When I started the "project" I was considering making my own manifold, and doing away with the "wierd" beer keg style...I am still thinking about, but that is down the road. Do you have an opinion on my quandry?
|
N56629
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
8/10/2005
21:33:06
| RE: V8 Throttle Body Swap
IP: Logged
Message:
"quick question. i am a machinist and i can do any boring or milling that i want to do. is it better to remove the torque steps and air horns on my v6 tb or just bolt on a v8 tb."
I guess it all depends on where you want to go afterwards. If you are a machinist I suggest that you go to 46mm. If you have access to a cnc then go with 46x48 or even 46x50. Those can be done on a manual mill but are somewhat more difficult. You can't go wider than 46mm because the shaft bearings are set deeper than on the v8 tb.
The 46mm is good on a mostly stock engine with basic mods. The 46x48 flows nearly or as well as the v8 tb mounted on a stock v6 manifold. The 46x50 flows as well or better than a v8 tb with little or no modification to the v6 manifold.
The advantages of using your stock tb should be obvious. You don't have to find the v8 tb and cable. I've sold a number of modified v6 tb's and no one has ever wished they had more.
|
N56629
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
8/10/2005
21:47:21
| RE: V8 Throttle Body Swap
IP: Logged
Message:
Doug, I'm not quite sure what your "quandry" is. Is it over whether or not to make your own manifold? That depends on your goal. You can easily build a 300+hp engine using the stock manifold. If you just want to be different, experiment or both, go for it. I would love to see three tb's on top of an IR manifold. In any case you would have to make a plenum cover or make it an intregal part of the manifold.
Don't the v6's already have #19 lb. injectors?
|
Doug
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
8/10/2005
22:44:19
| RE: V8 Throttle Body Swap
IP: Logged
Message:
One of my quandries was how much if any should I remove from the divider in the manifold, but it is no longer a problem, I removed about 2 inches(The manifold that I received was a EGR model, so I cut just below the EGR "tube" that runs through the divider) I also cut back just under 1 inch on the runners at a slightly different angle (45 degrees as veiwed from the bottom or belly pan area is was about 30 degrees). The other one was if I should fill in any areas with epoxy/aluminum/belzona. What do you think?
|
N56629
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
8/10/2005
22:49:05
| RE: V8 Throttle Body Swap
IP: Logged
Message:
Cutting the runners seems to be a crap shoot. The more you mod the engine and lower the gearing the more you might want to shorten the runners. If you shorten the runners definately reduce the volume of the manifold by filling. How much? Your guess is as good as mine.
|
daveshotdako
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
8/11/2005
10:11:57
| RE: V8 Throttle Body Swap
IP: Logged
Message:
thanks n56629. i do have a cnc mill and i program it using mastercam and autocad. are you saying that it should be 46mm at the plate and taper to 48mm or 50mm at the base of the tb? also i am going to mill off the air horns and the torque step. first though, i am going to get a v6tb out of a junkyard to mod so that i dont screw up the only one that i have and be without my dako with no other mode of transportation since i am getting my jeeps tranny rebuilt.
|
N56629
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
8/11/2005
12:42:45
| RE: V8 Throttle Body Swap
IP: Logged
Message:
This should help. By comparison a true 50mm is just over 3 sq in.
|
Gunner
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
8/11/2005
15:28:25
| RE: V8 Throttle Body Swap
IP: Logged
Message:
Thanks for the tips on the V6 TB modifications. I am going to get the TB machined rather than try to do the V8 swap.
|
Doug
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
8/11/2005
19:48:32
| RE: V8 Throttle Body Swap
IP: Logged
Message:
Yes, thank you for the assistance, I'll have to post pictures of the outcome and performance.
|
daveshotdako
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
8/12/2005
09:51:44
| RE: V8 Throttle Body Swap
IP: Logged
Message:
i will do the same once i get mine done. i plan on boring it out, removing the torque step, removing the airhorns, and any other mod that i can think of to it. thanks for all the help guys.
|
daveshotdako
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
8/17/2005
17:56:57
| RE: V8 Throttle Body Swap
IP: Logged
Message:
i am about to bore the stock v6 tb that i got to either 46mm or 48mm. which is better and do i have to do anything to the throttle plates? i have already made the s-bolt, milled off the airhorns completely, and removed the torque steps. also i ground down the throttle shaft. is there anything else that i could do to it besides boring it to 46 or 48mm.
|
cuzindoug
GenIII
8/17/2005
20:01:16
| RE: V8 Throttle Body Swap
IP: Logged
Message:
Radius and polish all edges when you are done with the bore. The "throat" opening to the manifold is 47.5mm so if you radius the manifold opening as well or put a tappered adapter between, I would go for the 48mm bore.
If it ain't broke, fix it til it is.
|
N56629
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
8/17/2005
21:21:17
| RE: V8 Throttle Body Swap
IP: Logged
Message:
You can't bore the stock v6 to 48mm. You will be hitting the shaft bearings. For god knows what reason, the bearings on the v6 tb are set in deeper than the v8 bearings.
See my drawings above. These are the only options you have unless you go this route.
|
cuzindoug
GenIII
8/18/2005
08:25:57
| RE: V8 Throttle Body Swap
IP: Logged
Message:
Thank you N56629, I didn't realize that the bearings were set in that deep. Sorry about the incorrect info daveshotdako, I guess you should go for the 46X48 or 46X50. But still remember that the intake manifold opening is only 47.5mm, so you either have to modify the manifold opening to this, or make an adapter plate. It's like N56629 said in another thread/post, air will flow easily from a smaller hole to a larger hole, but not the other way around.
If it ain't broke, fix it til it is.
|
daveshotdako
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
8/18/2005
09:26:53
| RE: V8 Throttle Body Swap
IP: Logged
Message:
thanks for the info. i still need to know if i have to do any mods to the throttle plates as well. also what if i made some alumminum bushings to go behind the bearings to move them out enough to bore to 48mm. if no one knows if this is possible, then what is the largest that i can bore it to withought hitting the bearings?
|
N56629
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
8/18/2005
13:12:33
| RE: V8 Throttle Body Swap
IP: Logged
Message:
The largest you can go is 46mm. If you make the bore larger than stock then you have to make new throttle plates. This means that the only thing you can do is remove the step unless you are able to make the new plates.
If you decide to make new plates make sure that you take some careful measurements. The two holes in the plate are .03 off center. This also means that if you disassemble the tb you have to make sure that you get them back in the same way as you took them out.
As for the 47.5 dia. dimension of the manifold it is a minor problem even if you go with the 46x50 bore. It's definately not worth making a transition plate. Such a plate would require two gaskets all of which would have to be in perfect alignment to effective.
|
daveshotdako
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
8/20/2005
21:03:54
| RE: V8 Throttle Body Swap
IP: Logged
Message:
next question... does anyone know the exact diminsions for a 46mm bore throttle plate and/or 48mm throttle plate. i am going to make inserts and remove the bearings and place alluminum inserts behind the bearings to move them out further so that i can get a 48mm bore. i just need the diminsions for the 48mm throttle plates.
|
N56629
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
8/20/2005
22:40:16
| RE: V8 Throttle Body Swap
IP: Logged
Message:
I usually make 46mm plates 46mm or a few thousandths less. Stock plates are slightly narrower on the sides. If you are making new plates you should note that the holes are not symetrical front to back which is why they only fit one way.
|
daveshotdako
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
8/31/2005
13:05:08
| RE: V8 Throttle Body Swap
IP: Logged
Message:
ok i have bored the stock v6 tb to 48mm. i pressed out the bearings and made some .050 aluminum bushings to space the bearings out far enough to bore to 48mm. now for the throttle plates. if i made them to 48mm, wouldnt they not close right or at all in a 48mm bore. i guess that i just need some better diminsions for them. i plan on burning them out on my wire edm but i just need some better dimension help before i program my machine.
|
N56629
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
8/31/2005
13:15:04
| RE: V8 Throttle Body Swap
IP: Logged
Message:
A few thousands smaller won't hurt. I had one plate that was about .015 smaller than the bore and it didn't seem to matter although I replaced it anyway. They don't usually close all the way. That's the primary purpose of the so-called idle screw. If you back off on the screw you will find that the throttle plates bind in the bore.
If you take a close look at your tb you will find that the shaft is approximately .03 off center. I assume they did this to reduce the chance of them binding. If you are this far you probably know that already.
|
| | <<Previous Page P 2 Next Page>> |
