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TuckerLudlow
GenI
 
10/31/2004
23:53:00
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 Subject: Throttle Bodies
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There are a couple of posts questioning throttle bodies - and I gotta tell you guys that are asking, these guys are telling you true when they say that it's the best buck you'll spend.
I spent several hours Saturday installing a used Fastman 3.9 TB that I purchased from one of the participants on this board. So far, I'm REALLY pleased with it. I wasn't after the performance that so many quote - and frankly, didn't immediately notice any difference in performance, although it's probably there. But, the gas mileage increase is GREAT, and I expect it to get better since I've only driven it about 100 miles (mostly road miles) since installation. According to the computer, I'm getting 2-3 mpg better than I used to.
I also noticed that one real aggravation that I had previously wasn't there in today's road trip. Prior to the TB install, my truck ('02 3.9 SLT, automatic) would downshift going up a long incline (scare the crap out of you if you weren't expecting it). I knew that it needed just a little more "omph!" to stop that, and the TB install seems to have fixed it. That downshift crap never happened with today's trip. So, that little extra HP helped out there, too.
I AM somewhat puzzled over the other performance change that I noticed, and that is that my truck (an automatic) seems to run thru the shifts and get into overdrive a lot quicker than it used to. How come? Anybody know?
The only things that I did was: 1) made an S-bolt for it, 2) cleaned a sensor (MAP, I think - pretty dirty to only have 37K on it), and 3) installed the Fastman.
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Joe
Dodge Dakota
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11/01/2004
00:53:20
| RE: Throttle Bodies
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how much did the TB cost i might have to get one after get twentys on my truck it brought down the miles/gallon
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N56629
Dodge Dakota
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11/01/2004
07:00:15
| RE: Throttle Bodies
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"i might have to get one after get twentys on my truck it brought down the miles/gallon."
Did you have your speedo recalibrated? Is your setup shorter or taller than stock?
You should be able to have your tb modded for about half the price that the fastman charges. I've done a number of these myself and it only takes about 2 hrs to mod. It shouldn't run more than $125. If you know what needs to be done, have a local shop do the work.
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Joe
Dodge Dakota
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11/01/2004
13:45:25
| RE: Throttle Bodies
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i didnt get the speedometer recalibrated, they said that id only be going 67 when the speedometer says 65 so 2mph isnt that bad i dont think it would be worth the money to recalibrate it.
How much does the fastman cost because i dont know how to modify a tb
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N56629
Dodge Dakota
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11/01/2004
15:23:24
| RE: Throttle Bodies
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"How much does the fastman cost because i dont know how to modify a tb"
TheFastman gets $250
Hughes Engines gets $165
I'm currently doing them for $125 with no work on the throttle plates or shaft. Gain there is minimal anyway.
In my opinion, modifying the v6 tb is a better way to go, but I'm bias. ;-)
I wouldn't talk anyone out of using a stock v8 tb though. A stock v6 flows about 360 and a stock v8 flows 700. That's about a 100% increase. A modified v6 should get you up to about 630 or a little more.
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Wadak
GenIII
11/01/2004
18:25:07
| RE: Throttle Bodies
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N56629
I have to disagree with you, I have taken my v6 throttle body and removed the torque step, air horns and polished it up, I have also tried, a v8 throttle body with the air horns on and the with the air horns removed, much better. I have also installed the 46mm fastman ( very good in my opinion, excellent craftmanship), I have also tried sick throttle's 47mm throttlebody, very good response, I have also tried a custom 49mm tb, high end response very good, but a loss of low end torque. I'm currently running a F and B which I purchased from a fellow forum member, the best by far for the v6. The second best is the fastman. If money is an issue get a v8 throttlebody, remove the air horns and leave the torque step in, this gives you a 47.5 mm open, the only other thing to do would to port match the intake manifold bore opening to 50mm throttle body plates.
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N56629
Dodge Dakota
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11/01/2004
19:19:48
| RE: Throttle Bodies
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"I have to disagree with you..."
Wadak, I'm not sure how we disagree. We seem to be in complete agreement. There may be some minor differences like instead of looking at just bore size, I tend to look at flow or cfm. It appears that we agree that a tb with 47-48mm bore will give about the best results.
Another point of disagreement would be suggesting that a novice should just start hacking away at v8 tb and expect to get good results. I've manage to repair a few bad ones recently and returned another as unrepairable. That one actually flowed less than stock and there wasn't enough material to risk cleaning it up.
Joe said he didn't know how to modify one and I went with that. For some people, buying a v8 tb and different linkage is more than they want to attempt. For those I suggest using a modified stock tb.
A lot of people haven't been matching the v8 tb to the manifold. I've even seen poorly matched gaskets hanging out into the bore. Seems like a waste of a nice port and polish job.
Is the tb your only mod?
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drew
Dodge Dakota
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11/01/2004
19:31:43
| RE: Throttle Bodies
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stupid question, what is a throttle body?
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GB2000
GenIII
11/01/2004
19:54:13
| RE: Throttle Bodies
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The metal thing under your airhat that opens when you hit the gas and brings air into the intake manifold...
Josh
http://www.cardomain.com/id/sentenced
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TuckerLudlow
GenI
11/01/2004
20:14:55
| RE: Throttle Bodies
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Dang, boys! I didn't mean to start a war here.
But - anybody have any ideas on why the truck all of sudden started shifting better? From a TB swap? What the devil does a TB have to do with an automatic shifting?
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N56629
Dodge Dakota
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11/01/2004
20:25:24
| RE: Throttle Bodies
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"The metal thing under your airhat that opens when you hit the gas and brings air into the intake manifold... "
Actually, it doesn't "bring" air in, it controls the amount of air that is allowed to pass.
For drew, it is much like a carburator except that gas doesn't mix with air at that point. That doesn't occur until the air travels almost all the way to the head where it mixes with gas from the injectors.
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N56629
Dodge Dakota
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11/01/2004
20:37:14
| RE: Throttle Bodies
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"But - anybody have any ideas on why the truck all of sudden started shifting better? From a TB swap? What the devil does a TB have to do with an automatic shifting?"
No war, Tucker.
My best guess would be that there is now a difference in the vacuum pressure being sensed at various speeds. You may have also changed the TV adjustment slightly. You didn't really give much in the way of details. At what speed did you go into OD before and after?
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RCF
Dodge Dakota
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11/01/2004
20:56:03
| RE: Throttle Bodies
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Have read a lot about having to change throttle cables when using a V8 throttle body. I have an '02 SXT and use a 318 throttle body from an early 90's Jeep Cherokee. The 3.9 throttle cable bracket fits perfectly on the V8 TB with no modifications. All sensors fit also. I'm using an Airaid cold air intake, Superchips programmer, Poweraid TB spacer, and the Jeep V8 TB. The thing has almost the same power as a '97 5.2 Dakota that I owned before I bought this one. Very pleased with it.
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Dingo
Dodge Dakota
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11/01/2004
21:50:04
|  RE: Throttle Bodies
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RCF I have 02 SXT also and noticed the same regarding cables with the change over to V8 TB. Did you do any mods to your TB or is it a stock V8??
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TuckerLudlow
GenI
11/01/2004
22:11:55
| RE: Throttle Bodies
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N56629 - I could kinda make it shift into OD by letting off the gas a little, but if I kept a steady pressure on it, it wouldn't shift until it hit approximately 45. Now, it zips on thru the gears and gets in OD a whole lot quicker than it used to. Doesn't seem to strain doing it, either.
After I read your post, I went looking for posts on the TV, and what you say makes sense. It's entirely possible that the connector on the new TB makes it a mm or two shorter - or longer, who knows? I know that I'm not messing with it - I LIKE what it's doing!
Next project is an MSD ignition. I bought a MSD6A on eBay several months ago, and it's sitting out in the barn, waiting for me to get around to installing it. Problem is, I haven't found a suitable place under the hood to mount the thing. Where have you guys mounted it? Mine's a Gen III, remember, with air, PS, PB and all the junk that goes with that stuff. The PB boost is the size of a darned soccer ball!
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Luke
Dodge Dakota
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11/02/2004
01:47:03
| RE: Throttle Bodies
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THe MSD fits on the driver side kind of behind the battery. (I think)I personaly do not have it I just think that is where I have heard other people put theirs.
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GB2000
GenIII
11/02/2004
02:42:29
| RE: Throttle Bodies
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I could kinda make it shift into OD by letting off the gas a little, but if I kept a steady pressure on it, it wouldn't shift until it hit approximately 45. Now, it zips on thru the gears and gets in OD a whole lot quicker than it used to. Doesn't seem to strain doing it, either.
Ha... I got my tv cable set so if I got the pedal mashed, I don't hit overdrive til 100mph. Once it hits overdrive, it doesn't pull nearly as hard and usually will top out around 110. Saw 115 once...but that was going down a slight decline. Anyway...since this isn't exactly a top speed post, I'll shut up now. lol
Oh yeah...N56629...I was wondering how accurate my description was of a throttle body. I almost put an "...i think." at the end of it.
Josh
http://www.cardomain.com/id/sentenced
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RCF
Dodge Dakota
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11/02/2004
11:56:26
| RE: Throttle Bodies
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I'm using a bone stock throttle body off of a 318 Jeep Cherokee. I did grind the sides down on the bracket that holds the airhat stud so it wouldn't hang out over the throttle bores. Before the throttle body changeout, this engine was all out of breath by 4500 RPM. Now it will make power up to 5400 or so before it seems to drop off. With the 5 speed transmission it is responsive.
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Joe
Dodge Dakota
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11/05/2004
00:40:27
| RE: Throttle Bodies
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GB2000 what size is ur engine becuz i floor it and i can only get to 100 becuz the damn computers got a governor or something becuz i cant pass 3000 rpm in overdrive
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GB2000
GenIII
11/05/2004
01:20:43
| RE: Throttle Bodies
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I got the 3.9L...max speed I've ever hit is 115 mph and that was going down a hill. Normally it'd hit 105-110 as long as I had the room since it doesn't pull very hard at that high of speeds. Not sure what my top speed is now since I got the bigger wheels and tires on it.
Josh
http://www.cardomain.com/id/sentenced
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N56629
Dodge Dakota
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11/05/2004
06:50:33
| RE: Throttle Bodies
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"Not sure what my top speed is now since I got the bigger wheels and tires on it."
Try this, Josh.
http://gs.tolan-hoechst.com/tirecalc.htm
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