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KJW
Dodge Dakota
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2/26/2003
20:40:39
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 Subject: Help On The T-Bars Guys!!
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I know someone out there has played with the T-Bars on the 4x4's so please help me out here. I do not want to do a body lift and a good suspension lift for 2001 is still questionable. So just to get the truck to sit level I have twisted on the T-Bars a bit.
A couple of questions:
1. How much if any can you twist them up without getting the front end realigned???
2. Does it make any sense that getting the front end aligned after twisting up the T-Bars would bring it back down??
2001 QC v-8 4x4 5spd.
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jason
Dodge Dakota
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2/26/2003
22:29:03
| RE: Help On The T-Bars Guys!!
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i can answer part of that. #1 i raised mine 1"1/2 to get level and havent had any problems , actually after i drove it i went half a mile down the road in a straight line without holding the wheel. just make sure when you do raise them that you mark the bolt and frame so you get the exact number of turns and so both bars are lifted the same. in my opinion i dont think youll have a problem.
#2 that all depends on the shop , most of them follow the factory specs.if you tell them not to touch the bars i dont think they can align it properly. because when you tighten the bars it adjusts the camber and toe of the front end and for the shop to get back to factory specs they compansate for the raise which brings it back down.this is just in my opinion. their are other guys on here that can probably answer this one a little better , just trying help
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KJW
Dodge Dakota
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2/26/2003
23:13:02
| RE: Help On The T-Bars Guys!!
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Thank You Jason.
That is exactly what happened to me. I turned them up and the alignment pulled it back down.
I marked my bolts as you did and also measured from the bottomm of the fender to the ground. I went 2 1/2 turns and got 1 1/4" and my truck sits straight now.
Truck drives fine no pull or drift and maybe just a little bit stiffer.....so little it's not even an issue. But I've read this may shorten the front end life. If so I'm wondering by how much.
Have you seen any unusual tire wear yet?
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jason
Dodge Dakota
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2/27/2003
08:41:51
| RE: Help On The T-Bars Guys!!
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alot of people will agree with me on this on . tighting them no more than 1"1/2 shouldnt put any more stress than normal its when you go past that point things start wearing a little faster. i put on new tires after i raised mine , i rotate them at 7000 miles and havent seen any unsual wear. it is a bit stiffer , but thats good in my opinion because their a little soft from the factory anyways.
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forexfour
GenIII
2/27/2003
11:28:35
| RE: Help On The T-Bars Guys!!
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Interesting points and what ever works. I have my torsion bars cranked to full had no problem aliging it. I lost no height and I am still at the same height as I was the day I cranked them. Almost a year now. The alignment needs are purely up to you but one not having wear problems does not mean you will not. Also when you think about what you are doing to the control arm, twisting it with a bar to make it raise up, the way the tire runs on the road will be affected. Just watch the wear like Jason and you may save $70.00 or you may not.
Jason is right allot of people agree with him you do not have to align with a minor cranking but there are others who have ruined tires.
Never late for a Tee time or wheelin with my buddies! Always ready for both!!!Forexfour's home
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KJW
Dodge Dakota
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2/27/2003
11:45:14
| RE: Help On The T-Bars Guys!!
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Yeah, the suspension is a little soft from the factory.
What you did is exactly what I'm doing also. That's why I was interested in knowing if you were getting some unusual wear on the front tires..... worse then 4x4's already get.
I was looking at tires yesterday and trying to make a choice on brand and size. Somewhat limited choice if you stay with the 16" rims..... but that's what I want to do with this truck.
One more question.
Have you noticed that the front end sagged back down over the past year?
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other bill
Dodge Dakota
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2/27/2003
11:45:50
|  RE: Help On The T-Bars Guys!!
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Careful on maxing out the T-bars.
I am not saying don't do it. I have 80K on my 95 and all of it has been with the front raised and I haven't had any problems.
What you Do need to do is look at how close your upper control arm has come down to the rubber bumpstops just underneath the upper contol arm. You can crank these things until they mash that bumpstop. I know, I "had" mine that high. That, and running out of threads on the adjustment bolts are the limiting factors on how much height you can get out of T-bars.
Once you start compressing the bumpstop, and continue to crank on them, you are now not only carrying the weight of the truck, you are also trying to compress that hard piece of rubber. This excess pressure from both ends is what causes them to wear out prematurely. Cranking them up a bit does Not wear them out early. All you are doing is a height adjustment. You can max the bolt out, so long you are not compressing that upper bumpstop up front.
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KJW
Dodge Dakota
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2/27/2003
11:59:48
| RE: Help On The T-Bars Guys!!
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Forexfour----Thanks for the input. I agree the tire should be affected somewhat I just was not sure if it would be something I could live with or not. Not a problem to rotate the tires more often as long as it can keep up with the results of the "frontend adjustment".
Did you do anything different on the realignment of the front after you turned them up?
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KJW
Dodge Dakota
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2/27/2003
12:10:00
| RE: Help On The T-Bars Guys!!
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Bill, that sheds some light on the premature failure issue. Sounds like you may have found out through personal expierence. I knew about watching the thread length but I was unaware of the "stop" problem. I'm going to get under there and check that.
Did you do anything special for the alignment?
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forexfour
GenIII
2/27/2003
12:23:45
| RE: Help On The T-Bars Guys!!
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I am always up under my truck changing out tires and such. I look for potential problems. Plus I keep it clean underneath. I think it may have sagged alittle. It still measures about the same as when it was first done. It has been aligned 2 times since for other mechanical repairs. Never did I have aproblem with the alignment except the time I actually went to Goodyear and they did not tighten the nuts on the control arm brackets.
I am also having the torsion bars changed and brought back down now that the lift is being installed. I may have to turn them up a little but we will have to wait and see.
Never late for a Tee time or wheelin with my buddies! Always ready for both!!!Forexfour's home
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other bill
Dodge Dakota
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2/27/2003
13:10:21
| RE: Help On The T-Bars Guys!!
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No, nothing has failed on my rig. I stiil have the original bars. No sagging. I too am always tinkering, and saw what was happening a number of years ago. It's simply the laws of physics. Once you come in contact with something, you start creating increased pressure. As far as alignment, I just watched my tires for uneven wear. Had none, so let it go.
Eventually replaced the tires when they wore out from normal use, and when the alignment shop performed the alignment (which you should ALWAYS due when installing new tires) I asked about adjustments. The guy said he only put in a minor few, nothing out of the ordinary.
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KJW
Dodge Dakota
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2/27/2003
20:52:30
| RE: Help On The T-Bars Guys!!
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Bill, I checked mine this afternoon and the stops don't look like they are being compressed but I do not see any daylite between the stop and the arm either. So I must be either right there or, starting to compress. I have lots of thread distance left I had checked that when I did it. I would like to keep the truck where it is because I have it sitting straight now but I will tinker a bit and see what it takes to get some clearance. 2 1/2 turns may be more then I should have gone.
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