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Bob
GenIII
10/22/2001
06:50:48
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 Subject: K&N void's warranty ???
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Message:
Some one asked this question in my new Mustang Magazine,I was getting ready to install a K&N filter when my Ford dealer told me it would void my warranty!
{Magazine}While we've always extolled the virtues of K&N filter for our Mustangs,we have heard of many dealers voiding warranty repairs{repairs,not the complete vehicle warranty}on contaminated mass meters due to the oil used in the filters ruining the meters sensor electronics.If this worries you,you might look into some of the new filters that do not use an oil medium in there filters.
My question-has any of you heard this and do you know of a good {dry} race filter.
GOD BLESS THE USA
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bernd
*GenIII*
10/22/2001
08:20:36
| RE: K&N void's warranty ???
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Message:
That's a common statement from just about any dealer. Aftermarket parts do NOT void the entire vehicle warranty...Federal Law prohibits the manufacturers from doing this.
http://www.sema.org/warranty (Magnusson-Moss Act)
BTW: The Ford Saleen, Bullit, and GM LS1's all come with a K&N filter. (So much for that theory)
1997 Dodge Dakota SLT - V6
Supercharged @ 10# w/Nitrous
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Wayne
Dodge Dakota
10/22/2001
13:00:47
| RE: K&N void's warranty ???
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Message:
Hey Bernd - which LS1s comes with K&N? My '98 'T/A didn't. I let you know about my '02 soon (it is on order). GM has refused to fix a friends T/A because they had a K&N and the mass air meter went out. They didn't fight it.
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robert
Dodge Dakota
10/22/2001
14:42:46
| RE: K&N void's warranty ???
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Message:
Although there may be laws on the books to prevent manufacturers from voiding warrantees... unless you have a lawyer in your back pocket, the dealer will do what they want.
Also, if the dealer thinks the aftermarket part caused the problem at hand, they DO NOT have to honor the warranty work for that service.
Therefore if a mass air meter went out... it sounds like the air cleaner could very easily be blamed for the problem. Now remember, I did not say that the air cleaner did in fact cause the failure... but since the parts are related enough, the dealer has the advantage.
Using aftermarket parts is going to have to be a judment call on each owners part.
Again, laws mean nothing without a lawyer and litigation (sp?).
One last thing. We all know how much of a pain D/C is. Just take the warped brake rotors as an example. Do you really thing they will be any easier to deal with when they find non-oem parts bolted on? Don't get me wrong, I am a huge fan of aftermarket parts... I just want to explain reality.
"Common sense isn't that common..."
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Steve
Dodge Dakota
10/22/2001
16:20:58
| RE: K&N void's warranty ???
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Message:
I really don't think that a K&N filter can void a vehicles warrenty. Your the one purchasing the filter and I don't see what the matter is. From what I hear, unless the dealer supplies you with free air filters, you can use whatever filter you want without any problems.
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jay
Dodge Dakota
10/22/2001
19:46:58
| RE: K&N void's warranty ???
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Message:
directly from the back of the k&n box:
VEHICLE WARRANTY
k&n filtercharger will not void your vehicle warranty. The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act passed in 1982 makes it illegal for a manufacturer to void a new vehicle warranty if the consumer uses non-OEM filters unless that manufacturer provides filters free of charge. If the manufacturer does not provide air filters free of charge, they cannot void the vehicle's warranty simply because you have installed an aftermarket air filter..
Now, if they could void your warranty for aftermarket filters then technically they could void your warranty if you used a different oil filter, fuel filter, transmission filter, so on and so forth......i have heard that the filter oil on k&n's filters can cause problems with sensors, but if you read k&n's instructions they specifically say DO NOT OVER OIL YOUR FILTER, a k&n only requires a light coating of oil it doesn't have to be on so thick that it is dripping off, and if it is then you have applied way too much oil and then yes,,, you could suck oil up into a mass air sensor or onto another sensor. If you follow your directions properly and do what they suggest then their should be no problems. Secondly if you know anything about fords or gm's then you would know that those mass air sensors are a pain in the a*s anyways and they are always blowin out, i put 3 mass air sensors on my z-28 in 2 years, they are just a bad design and known for premature failure. i highly doubt that the minute amount of oil that actually reachs the mass air sensor will make that much difference in it's performance and if it were to blow then it would probably be caused by something else not working right rather then by the oil of a k&n filter....
unless the aftermarket part that is in question has caused the direct failure of another part then they can do absolutely nothing about it.... NOTHING!!!!!!
For example: if you install an aftermarket ignition coil and your then a week later your water pump blows, they cannot deny you warranty coverage on the water pump for the ignition coil being installed because an ignition coil has nothing to do with your water pump.
If they question a part then they better have a da*n good reason for the part causing the failure which in turn means if your mass air sensor blows from k&n oil getting on it then they better be able to provide the proof and also have logical proof not what some backyard mechanic thinks but a technical and through explanation or else they have no case and you have everything in the world against them.
do not let aftermarket parts threaten you into not using them because you think your warranty will be voided, if that were the case then mopar performance and GM performance parts would not exist....
jay
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Bob
GenIII
10/22/2001
20:34:10
| RE: K&N void's warranty ???
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Message:
Man..Thanks for the input.I have run a K&N in my Mustang for a few years with no problems and I have had one in my Dakota for about 7 months with no troubles.I think what all of you have said makes sense to me,Jay said don't over oil it when you clean it,sounds about right to me,my plan with my truck was to put a stock filter in for the winter months [Ohio} and clean the K&N and oil it per instructions and let it set all winter,oil should have run off the filter,after 4 or 5 months.
Bernd did you get your truck lowered yet?
Wayne when do you get your FireBird?
Zoom zoom zoom
GOD BLESS THE USA
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Wayne
Dodge Dakota
10/23/2001
10:54:40
| RE: K&N void's warranty ???
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Message:
New Trans Am in 2 months, Bob. Silver with chrome rims and 3.23 rear.
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3rd Gen
Dodge Dakota
10/23/2001
12:00:41
| RE: K&N void's warranty ???
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Message:
Your Warranty will not be void if your install addons such as filters and mufflers in the 3/36 period.
Personally scenario, I put a K&N filter and Flowmaster 40 series on my '97 dakota the first month I bought the truck 4 years ago. Took it to the dealership for an oil change and even had the the PCM reprogramed by Mopar. My Proof is the sticker under the hood shows its Mopar inspected and approved.
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DodgeTrucks
Dodge Dakota
10/23/2001
12:09:15
|  RE: K&N void's warranty ???
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Message:
If I'm not mistaken our Dakota's don't have Mass Air Sensors in the air intake to worry about!
1 advanatage over the others guy's
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Bob
GenIII
10/23/2001
18:26:45
|  RE: K&N void's warranty ???
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Message:
Hey-3rd Gen,what did they do to the PCM and how did you find a dealer to do that?
Wayne is that bird going to have them BIG holes in the hood,you know,the ones that suck up ever thing but Mustangs JAJ ! Well it have a K&N from the factory?
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Wayne
Dodge Dakota
10/24/2001
06:49:01
| RE: K&N void's warranty ???
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Message:
Bob - No big holes in this one. I started to order a Firehawk but I have to walk too far at the shopping malls now. I would park even farther away with one of them, if you know what I mean. It comes with a regular type filter.
BTW, I never had to worry about sucking any cars into those holes (including Mustangs) because they never get in front of me. Hahaha
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Wayne
Dodge Dakota
10/24/2001
06:55:39
| RE: K&N void's warranty ???
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Message:
You guys that say that the K&N doesn't void warranty are correct (as I understand the law), but If the dealership says they aren't going to cover the price of a mass air meter what are you going to do? Lawyers are more expensive than mass air meters. My solution was to put the original filter back in the car when I bring it in for warranty work on my Trans Am. It isn't a problem with the 3.9, 5.2, or 5.9 because they don't have mass air meters as Dodge Trucks says. I don't know about the 4.7.
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robert
Dodge Dakota
10/24/2001
11:13:24
| RE: K&N void's warranty ???
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Message:
Wayne,
You explained exactly what I was trying to point out earlier. Everyone is correct that, LEGALLY, warranties cannot be voided because of aftermarket parts. But, when the dealer says they aren't going to honor the warranty because of your aftermarket part... what are you going to do? Some people have a hard time understanding that it takes a lawyer to enforce the law. And this is a very expensive process.
You can't just call the police to the dealer and force them to warrant your vehicle!
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Knobbyman
GenIII
10/24/2001
12:42:19
| RE: K&N void's warranty ???
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Message:
Wayne that's a great idea and would work great for drop in filters.. Now I'm almost hoping that the K&N GenII isn't all that much more powerful that way I can just drop in a K&N and not have to wory about it ;-)
'01 Graphite QC 4x4
4.7 3.55 LSD
http://www.knobbyman.com
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Knobbyman
GenIII
10/24/2001
12:48:06
| RE: K&N void's warranty ???
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Message:
Wayne that's a great idea and would work great for drop in filters.. Now I'm almost hoping that the K&N GenII isn't all that much more powerful that way I can just drop in a K&N and not have to wory about it ;-)
'01 Graphite QC 4x4
4.7 3.55 LSD
http://www.knobbyman.com
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Knobbyman
GenIII
10/24/2001
12:49:41
| RE: K&N void's warranty ???
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Message:
whoops
'01 Graphite QC 4x4
4.7 3.55 LSD
http://www.knobbyman.com
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