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YJ
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
6/12/2002
15:37:27
|
 Subject: Auto flush and fill.
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Message:
Well,
After speaking with the dealer, and several other local shops, I've decided to try to do the 45RFE flush and service myself. The dealer wants $310 for a transmission service (includes flush). I haven't been able to confirm what aftermarket fluids I can put in the 45RFE because there seems to be a million conflicting opinions. Even after I tell them it's a 2000 dakota with a 45RFE, the local shops said they could do a full flush and service for $120. I then ask them, "Do you know that it takes two filters?" "Oh, no I didn't." "Do you know what type of fluid it takes?" "Yeah, standard Chrysler ATF+3." Well, I'm gonna pick up 13 quarts of mopar atf+4, the two filters, and some copper high-temp silicone. Should run me around $130 for the parts. Crap! I will also replace the differential fluid. My jeep was a piece of cake, I hope this will be the same.
Please please please, tell me if you have ANY tips at all for the tranny service or the differential fluid change. Any ideas on the capacity of the diffs (3.92)?
--This truck is so darn expensive. ; )
Thanks guys,
YJ
Black 2K QC 4x4 4.7 3.92 KVT910DVD
Black 91 YJ 4LHO Borla | 5" Suspension | 33BFGMT
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Blckdak
GenIII
6/12/2002
16:52:03
| RE: Auto flush and fill.
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Message:
I gave my dealer 20qts of AMSOIL Tranny fluid and they did they flush and filter change, used up all the fluid and was charged 198.00. That was including a 4 wheel break check and adjustment. Might want to get a few more qts of fluid. Mine included the torque converter as well.
Erin
2000 CC 4x4 Sport
Magnaflow Exhaust, Z-Tube, Runnin AMSOIL
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YJ
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
6/12/2002
17:10:57
| RE: Auto flush and fill.
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Message:
Thanks Blckdak.
Any other tips from anyone would be much appreciated.
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Dr. D
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
6/12/2002
19:08:06
| RE: Auto flush and fill.
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Message:
Transmission flush and fill machines DO NOT DO as
good of a job as you may think that they do, would
you like for me to post a better and much cheaper
way to do the same job?
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YJ
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
6/12/2002
19:11:00
| RE: Auto flush and fill.
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Message:
Pwetty Pwease? ; )
Also, if anyone knows what the heck the differential fluid capacity is for the front and rear off of a 2K Quad Cab with 3.92 and those crazy 8.25 and 9 inchers (not sure if that matters), I'd surely appreciate it. It's not in my owners manual.
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sandman
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
6/12/2002
19:27:48
|  RE: Auto flush and fill.
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Amsoil has a pretty simple method listed on their corprate site for getting all of the old fluid out while filling with synthetic. For those people with new vechiles I would just drain the trans at 10,000 change primary filter(cheap one) and leave the secondary alone and refil. Then at 30,000 drain and change both filters and refill again. When I drained mine and changed filters it took 8 quarts of fluid. I used Redline C+ATF. I figure when I change it again at 24,000 to 30,000 that 8 more quarts of synthetic will probably be enough to elimanate most of the semi-synthetic fluid that cam with it from the factory. Flush and Fill will give more uniform results but I doubt you will notice much difference if you have not neglected or abused your truck. Flushing provides the most noticeable result if you have allowed the fluid to oxidize and boil off.
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Dr. D
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
6/13/2002
00:50:20
| RE: Auto flush and fill.
IP: Logged
Message:
1.
Make sure the fluid is warm. Warm up
the car so the transmission is at normal operating
temperature. Pull the
transmission dipstick (located near the
firewall in most cars). Fresh fluid is translucent
and cherry red. Some
darkening is normal, but if it is
reddish brown or mustard color and smells like
burnt varnish, it is worn out.
2.
Drain the fluid by loosening the pan.
Select the correct Hastings filter replacement
based on pan shape and
prepare a large pan to catch the fluid.
Then loosen each pan bolt a turn or two and loosen
one corner more than
rest. Drain mostly from this corner.
3.
Finish removing the pan and any gasket
material from the pan or case. Avoid scratching
the metal and make sure
the pan’s gasket surface isn’t bent or
distorted.
4.
Remove the old filter. Most
transmission filters are held in place with a bolt
or two, but some are held by a clip. Be
careful to include O-Rings or other
seals.
5.
Install a new filter. Use the clips or
bolts from the old filter. Be sure O-Rings, etc.
are in place. If the filter has a
long intake neck, gently push the neck
into place without unseating the O-Ring.
6.
Clean the pan thoroughly. Inspect the
pan before cleaning. A small amount of fine grey
clutch dust is normal.
However, if you find metal shavings,
there has been transmission damage. Clean the pan
with solvent and wipe dry
so there is no harmful residue.
7.
Position gasket on pan. Some gaskets
have four holes slightly smaller than the rest to
allow four bolts through the
pan and through these smaller holes to
hold the gasket in place.
8.
Hand tighten pan bolts in a criss-cross
pattern. After that, use a torque wrench to
tighten bolts to proper ft-lbs as
per manufacturer.
9.
Refill the transmission using only the
amount shown as “refill capacity” in the owners
manual or "AMSOIL
Product Selection Guide,” using the
type of fluid specified for the vehicle.
10.
If doing only a partial fluid
replacement, skip to instruction 12 below. If
doing a complete fluid replacement,
follow the steps in instruction 11.
11.
You now have replaced the fluid in the
pan. To replace the fluid in the torque converter
and oil cooler also, follow
these steps.
Step 1. Obtain the total system
capacity of the vehicle from the manufacturer or
AMSOIL. Have this amount
readily available.
Step 2. Disconnect the oil cooler line
from the oil cooler. As you may not know which is
the pressure side and
which is the return side, have both
directed so the stream of fluid will be directed
toward a receptacle.
Step 3. With another person, be
prepared to add ATF to the fill area as it is
being pumped out of the oil cooler
line.
Step 4. Start the engine, and as the
old fluid is pumped out, add fresh fluid to the
pan.
Step 5. When either the fluid color
brightens or the total capacity has been replaced,
shut the engine off and
re-attach the oil cooler line. All
fluids has now been changed.
12.
Recheck the fluid level. With the car
on level ground, set the parking brake and the
transmission in “Park” or
“Neutral.” Let the engine idle for a
few minutes. Shift the transmission into different
positions before returning
the lever to “Park” or “Neutral.” Check
the fluid level again and check for leaks.
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Dr. D
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
6/13/2002
01:50:20
| RE: Auto flush and fill.
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Message:
YJ,
I know that according to check chart
publications the rear axle in your truck has a 4.4
pint capacity and I would need to know which axle
you have in the front to look up it's capacity.
Do you have a C205F, DANA 44 or a DANA 60 up
front?
I usually order the AMSOIL gear lube by the case
just in case I or one of my friends need it
quickly (it doesn't go bad).
|
AmsoilSponsor
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
6/13/2002
09:33:47
| RE: Auto flush and fill.
IP: Logged
Message:
YJ,
Since you asked "tell me if you have ANY tips at all for the tranny service or the differential fluid change" I thought I would post the following as helpful information. It appears to me Dr. D. had suggestions regarding tranny fluids so I will post regarding differential fluid change.
Dak owners ... Don't shoot me (the Amsoil Sponsor) for posting, just trying to help without sounding like a commercial.
-------------------------------------------------
Helpful Differential Recommendations:
-Flush (drain) as much of the old fluid out.
-Differential fluid capacity depends on ring gear and axle housing size.
-Do not over/under fill differential. This could mean a capacity difference of a quart or more and may cause overheating problems. (See the owner’s manual for proper fill level)
AMSOIL gear oils are formulated with friction modifiers for limited slip differential applications. There is no need to add limited slip or additional additives. If you choose a different manufacturer than Amsoil ... fine by me, just offering my services.
-After changing the differential fluid, drive the vehicle in 7 or 8 figure eight turns, so the new lubricant can work its way into the axle assembly.
Synthetics provide the long-lasting protection, fuel efficiency and dependability needed for top performance, even extreme-pressure conditions. Stays fluid in cold temperatures for easy cold-weather shifting.
----------------------
Amsoil Series 2000 75w-90 is excellent for use in passenger cars and trucks requiring a GL-5 gear lube, including those with limited slip differentials.
If you are considering Amsoil and would like a free catalog you can reach me thru the "billboard ad" on the home page or via email.
Thank You,
Steven Roark, Amsoil Dealer
www.american-synthetic-oil.com
sroark@american-synthetic-oil.com
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CanaDak
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
6/13/2002
09:54:14
|  RE: Auto flush and fill.
IP: Logged
Message:
FYI
15 year + Amsoil user
Amsoil universal synthetic ATF meets your Dodge spec's and is completely compatible with the existing fluid that would be left in the system.
|
YJ
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
6/13/2002
11:48:01
|  RE: Auto flush and fill.
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Message:
You guys are great. Thanks for posting your tips and suggestions.
Dr. D - It must be the 205 up front. If you could post the capacity and torque setting for the bolts front/rear (if you have 'em), I'd be much obliged. Thanks so much.
CanaDak - I've heard of how great Amsoil is, my only concern is that this new tranny (45RFE) seems to act like a sensitive child. In the manual, it says to put ATF+3, but they changed it over to ATF+4 for whatever reason. I would love to run a synthetic (Amsoil), but I'm not convinced that a UNIVERSAL tranny fluid could really meet all of the specific dependencies for all car manufacturers. If I didn't feel like the tranny was falling apart at 30K, I'd probably be using Amsoil. Thank you for your suggestion, though. I appreciate any info you can offer.
Amsoil Sponsor - My manual doesn't include the differential capacities. But it did show the torque settings on the tranny pan! ; ) But not the differential bolts. ; (
Thank you guys. If anyone has any more info, I'd appreciate your post. ; ) Also, I'll post on how the diff and the tranny service went.
YJ
Black 2K QC 4x4 4.7 3.92 KVT910DVD
Black 91 YJ 4LHO Borla | 5" Suspension | 33BFGMT
|
Dr. D
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
6/13/2002
12:52:00
| RE: Auto flush and fill.
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Message:
YJ,
There are a lot of transmission repair shops using
the AMSOIL "Universal" Transmission Fluid. The
"Universal" fluid meets and or exceeds the latest
specs for GM, Ford and Chrysler. I know a lot of
people who will use nothing but the Amsoil fluid
and I know of a few who are using the Supershift
synthetic racing transmission fluid in there late
model GM, Ford and Chrysler vehicles and the
Supershift fluid is nothing more than a Type "F"
synthetic fluid that gives you a firm and more
positive shift.
Bill Farlow a writer and R.V. maintainence
consultant for Woodall's R.V. magazine sold me on
this product (Amsoil Universal Fluid) years ago
and I have NEVER looked back!
Dr. D
p.s.
The capacity of a C205F front axle is 3.5 pints
(the lubrication recommendation guide that I have
does not list torque specs)
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YJ
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
6/13/2002
13:13:15
| RE: Auto flush and fill.
IP: Logged
Message:
Thanks again, Dr. D.
I don't doubt that Amsoil makes one of the best transmission fluids out there. My concern is not with their product, but rather with Chrysler's product. The brand spankin' new, computer controlled, double-filtered, infamously lame, 45RFE 5 speed auto tranny. (Well, 4 + a split 2nd.)
Anyone own one of these and use Amsoil??? Please let me know what's been happening. I'd really like to use Amsoil. I just want a bit of extra assurance from someone who's actually had to deal with this quirky/sensitive transmission.
Also, I plan on using a high-temp, sensor-safe, black silicone for the pan and differential gaskets. Please let me know if I should be using something different. Would hate to drive off, leaking all over the place.
Thanks again!
YJ
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D D D Dakota
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
6/13/2002
13:16:21
| RE: Auto flush and fill.
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Message:
I have been using the Amsoil Universal Fluid in every type of tranny since 1981 and I don't look for problems with it now. Amsoil has gone so far with this issue that they made a statement on their Q&A section of their website that they will pay for any tranny problems if warranty is solely refused because they are using this universal fluid. Then Amsoil will go after the dealership to recover their money. That is a strong statement and I know they will back it up. Amsoil has been fully tested to meet all these requirements with one type of fluid.
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AmsoilSponsor
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
6/13/2002
13:21:24
| RE: Auto flush and fill.
IP: Logged
Message:
The earlier statement is true (per my knowledge and per the Amsoil corporate website):
Amsoil will pay for any transmission problems if the warranty is refused because they are using the AMSOIL "Universal" Transmission Fluid. Amsoil will then go to the dealership to reclaim their money.
That is a strong statement and I know they will back it up.
Steven Roark, Amsoil Dealer
www.american-synthetic-oil.com
|
BlueBayou
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
6/13/2002
14:20:47
|  RE: Auto flush and fill.
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Message:
I understand that Amsoil will go after the dealer and fix my tranny if there is a problem due to the fluid, but i would really like someone to tell me how one fluid can meet different specs. It was my understanding that Chrysler tranny fluid has a different friction coefficient. It is either more or less slippery then the other GM or Ford fluid. how can one fluid meet both requirements?
Why does every other manufacturer have to add friction modifiers to tranny fluid?
Does the spec not detail how slippery the fluid is?
I too want to use some Universal Tranny Fluid, but the answer of "It does" doesn't mean S&^T these days. No offense to Amsoil.
I need to do my tranny soon and would like to be convinced of the Universal way of life.
Blue
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YJ
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
6/13/2002
17:34:54
| RE: Auto flush and fill.
IP: Logged
Message:
Anyone else's thoughts?
|
AmsoilSponsor
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
6/13/2002
19:57:57
| RE: Auto flush and fill.
IP: Logged
Message:
AMSOIL Synthetic Automatic Transmission Fluid is completely compatible with other synthetic and petroleum automatic transmission fluids. AMSOIL ATF is a universal, multifunctional fluid.
Transmission Identification Code Listings:
These guides are used to identify which transmission is in a vehicle; some vehicles have three automatic transmissions possible. These guides are also published in the AMSOIL G-194 Oil & Air Filter Application Guide.
This information is needed to "look-up" transmission fluid capacity or the correct transmission filter part number. Manufacturers' such as General Motor, Ford, and Chrysler use different transmissions in "matching" the drive train (transmission, differential, and motor).
If you have ACROBAT perhaps this will help.
(I borrowed it from the AMSOIL site)
http://www.amsoil.com/products/transmission/transmissions01.pdf
Hope what you were looking for is here and I will keep researching and get back to you YJ.
Steven Roark, Amsoil Dealer
www.american-synthetic-oil.com
|
AmsoilSponsor
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
6/13/2002
20:27:49
| RE: Auto flush and fill.
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Message:
AMSOIL Synthetic Universal ATF
Recommended for applications requiring the following specifications:
Chrysler ATF+, ATF+2, ATF+3, ATF+4
-------------------------------------------------
Again ...Please don't shoot me (the Amsoil Sponsor) for posting, just trying to help without sounding like a commercial.
-------------------------------------------------
AMSOIL synthetic automatic transmission fluid is a universal ATF designed to exceed nearly all foreign and domestic performance requirements. It improves fuel efficiency, reduces transmission temperatures by 20 to 50 degrees F and increases transmission life. Provides unsurpassed thermal stability and at least 3 times the life of conventional ATFs. Delivers maximum protection for towing and other severe-duty applications. Formulated with synthetic basestocks and the top-of-the-line additive package, AMSOIL ATF provides top performance, durability & efficiency.
Key Benefits to You:
Cleaner transmission components, More efficient power transfer, Lower Transmission temperatures, Dramatically less transmission wear, Smoother cold temperature operation, Long drain intervals, Compatible Applications: Nearly all passenger cars (foreign & domestic), Nearly all light duty trucks (including Dodge Dakotas)
TYPICAL TECHNICAL PROPERTIES (from Amsoil Site)
AMSOIL 100% Synthetic Automatic Transmission Fluid (ATF)
Kinematic Viscosity @ 100°C, cSt (ASTM D-445) 7.5
Kinematic Viscosity @ 40°C, cSt (ASTM D-445) 36.0
Viscosity Index (ASTM D-2270) 182
Noack Volatility, % weight loss (DIN 51581) 10.8
Flash Point °C (°F) (ASTM D 92) 222 (432)
Pour Point °C (°F) (ASTM D 97) -56 (-69)
Four Ball Wear Test (ASTM D 4172B: 40 kg, 75°C, 1200 rpm, 1 hour, Scar in mm) 0.40
Brookfield Viscosity (cP) -10°C = 465
Brookfield Viscosity (cP) -20°C = 1030
Brookfield Viscosity (cP) -30°C = 2505
Brookfield Viscosity (cP) -40°C = 7150
I am sure "Sandman" and perhaps "Dr. D" can help explain the above technical properties.
If I am not answering your questions let me know.
Steven Roark, Amsoil Dealer
www.american-synthetic-oil.com
|
Throttle
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
6/13/2002
21:53:06
| RE: Auto flush and fill.
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Message:
Torque specs for diff. cover bolts - 30 ft.lbs.
|
AmsoilSponsor
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
6/14/2002
08:41:16
| RE: Auto flush and fill.
IP: Logged
Message:
Thank you Throttle for the info:
Torque specs for diff. cover bolts - 30 ft.lbs
We have ordered tech and service books for Dodge Dakota so that we can offer better advice in the future. I did not have the information you provided. Thanks.
Any additional questions?
Steven Roark, Amsoil Dealer
www.american-synthetic-oil.com
|
BlueBayou
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
6/14/2002
09:56:11
| RE: Auto flush and fill.
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Message:
No offense, but nobody has answered my question, and I'm not really sure if anybody can. I am just one of those persons that want's as much detail as possible. Unfortunetly I don't understand the detail.
Sponsor - Thanks for the specifications, unfortunetly, they don't mean anything to me. My main concern is friction. Do the specs detail that and how does it compare with Chrysler ATF +4?
I'm just confused as to how different manufactures require different amounts of friction for their products to work, and yet one fluid provides both.
I just don't get it. Any help would be great.
Blue
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YJ
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
6/14/2002
12:44:29
| RE: Auto flush and fill.
IP: Logged
Message:
Thanks, Throttle, for getting the torque spec for me!
Good question, BlueBayou.
YJ
Black 2K QC 4x4 4.7 3.92 KVT910DVD
Black 91 YJ 4LHO Borla | 5" Suspension | 33BFGMT
|
sandman
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
6/14/2002
22:44:16
| RE: Auto flush and fill.
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Message:
If you do not fell comfortable with universal use Redline. I still have not been convinced yet either. I am also worried about the friction carateristics of this Universal fluid. Chevron has published some studies about this subject. I have also obseved this with my moms plymoth laser. My dad put Dexron III in instead of ATF+3 and the car shifted like SH*T. It would shift late, slip, and then shift realy hard. This went on for for about a week. My mom asked me to drive it. I could not belive how it was shifting. So I asked my Dad what he put in the trany. He said"Dexron III". I told him that you had to use ATF+3 in her car. He did not belive me. We droped the pan drained it and filled it with just under a gallon of ATF+3 and the trany acted just like new!!!! SO I know that there is a definite difference in fluid friction charteristics. Redline makes a synthetic fluid that is designed just for ATF+++++ aplications. I have used it for over 5000 miles. I put it in dureing the coldest months of winter. It shifts great. I can not tell any difference between it and the orignal OEM fluid interms of shift quality.
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YJ
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
6/17/2002
13:32:20
|  RE: Auto flush and fill.
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Message:
Well....I went to the dealer to pick up a few parts. They offered $50 off the original quoted price for a tranny service and also offered to have it done that day. So I said, "What the heck, let's hope they've gotten better since they're now 5-star rated." This is Dodge of Bellevue near Seattle, WA. Had them do a tranny service and differential drain and fill for the front/rear. Told them the specs, 45RFE tranny needing atf+4 and two filters, rear diff needs limited slip additive and 75w90. Well, picked it up just before close. Drove it home and the tranny is much smoother now.
Took it out that night, and I can hear this awful grinding sound when turning+accelerating from a stop. Anybody had their diffs serviced and heard of this???
Thanks guys.
YJ
And thanks again for all of the info.
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Dr. D
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
6/17/2002
16:11:06
| RE: Auto flush and fill.
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I own a Dodge a Chevy and my Fiance owns a Ford (all late models) and we use just one fluid in everything.
SOOOO NICE !
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sandman
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
6/17/2002
21:24:35
|  RE: Auto flush and fill.
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Message:
Stop Driveing your truck!!! They did not put additive in your rear diff. Get them to document that they forgot to add it and that they servived it!!! If they do not fill out a work order on it; it will not be documented. You want this for warranty purposes down the road. They will try to just pull it in and add the additive. Make sure it get documented that they messed up!!!!!
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Dr. D
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
6/17/2002
21:56:15
| RE: Auto flush and fill.
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Message:
Or they drained the gear lube and replaced the rear cover and then got side tracked and FORGOT to install the gear lube.
I know that this has happened before.
Dr.D
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Big Blue QC
GenIII
6/18/2002
08:09:19
| RE: Auto flush and fill.
IP: Logged
Message:
YJ & BlueBayou,
have had AMSOIL ATF in mine since 4000 miles, just turned 25000 miles, not ONE problem to speak of.
YJ, glad to hear you had the flush done since I think it would have been impossible for you to do it. Dropping the pan and draining does not get all the fluid out, maybe 1/2 but don't quote me on that.
2002 QC 4x4 Sport Plus, 4.7L, auto, Patriot Blue, Tire & Handling group,
Heavy Duty Service group, Leer cap w/out windows, Mopar Step bars and roof rack, Rhino liner in bed and on step bars, Pace Edwards Power Tailgate lock
3.55 rear, 4-wheel anti-lock brakes, all possible fluids are AMSOIL
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YJ
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
6/18/2002
12:52:08
| RE: Auto flush and fill.
IP: Logged
Message:
Dealer didn't do a flush, just a service. Only replaced about half of the fluid. Runs much better but not perfect. Taking it to the dealer tonight, with 8 items for them to look at and hopefully fix (warranty).
Just as an update, the gears are no longer grinding for some reason. Happened for a day and a half and only while turning hard. I double checked the dealer receipt and it showed two of the limited slip additives being charged for. Since they are brilliant enough to put the additives up front, I'm taking it to a different dealer for the following work to be done:
Intermittent Grinding from gears, rough engine idle after 20+ mins of running, clunking and squeaking from front-end when turning, AC unit incredibly loud at times, suspension/body has an increasing amount of snapping/creaking/popping, 45RFE tranny has intermittent thumping/slipping, steering has a light thumping sensation and can feel a large amount of vibration, engine periodically jumps to 220 degrees then back down to 190ish, apply any recalls.
30K mile Schedule A service has been completed.
I hope they take it for a test drive and total it. I have no friggin' idea why I love this truck.
Thanks guys. I'll let you know what they come up with.
YJ
Black 2K QC Sport 4x4 4.7 3.92 KVT910DVD
Black 91 YJ 4LHO Borla | 5" Suspension | 33BFGMT
|
BuyA...
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
6/18/2002
14:03:33
| RE: Auto flush and fill.
IP: Logged
Message:
Holy S-IT. Why do people buy Daks if they have so many problems?
I have only been reading this board for one week , trying to decide if I should buy a Dak. After reading all this I'm gonna buy a Lexus SUV like my father because he has "never" had a problem beyond a Beaitch backing into him.
Later Boys (waving as he passes the Dakota Garage)
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