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General Dakota Board
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.boB
Dodge Dakota
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8/04/2007
15:55:10
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 Subject: RE: new truck opinions
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If you do a LOT of towing, or tow really heavy loads on occasion, the diesel makes a lot of sense.
I tow sometimes. Probably only about 7-8 week ends a year. In the past it's been no more than 100 miles one way. But this year I expect some longer hauls. The load I carry is only about 3,500#, and low drag to boot.
A diesel would sure be nice. But the initial cost of even a used one is quite high. Something with less than 30K miles is going to run you about $32-35,000. That's a lot of dough. OTOH, a similar Dakota with a 4.7 will cost you about $23,000. It's more like $20-25K differance for a new one! I can buy a lot of gasoline for $25,000. And my Dak only gets 9mpg when I tow.
Replacement parts for a heavy duty truck are more expensive. I replaced a power steering pump not long ago. I think that was about $35. What about a Cummins P/S pump? I can change the oil in my truck with a good quality filter and a top of the line synthetic oil for about $25. I change every 7,500 miles. What's it cost, and how often , for a Cummins? And also look at tires. After 50,000 miles I replaced my Michelin LTX tires for <$600 out the door, lifetime warrenty. What about a big heavy duty truck? I don't know the answers to those questions, but I expect the numbers are a bit higher.
I sat down and figured it not too long ago - based on fuel costs and list price only. If you tow a lot the break even point is fairly low, like 45,000 miles. If you're like me, the break even point was considerably higher, like 90K miles. And I didn't try to facter in maintenance and repair costs.
Sure, I'd love to have a big diesel truck. It sure would make towing a lot easier. But day to day use wouldn't be as cheap. my Dak now has 92K miles on it. I would just now be getting to the break even point. Assuming something big didn't break, like a lift pump.
After carefull consideration, the best truck around for the week end hauler and daily driver is a Dakota with 5.9. If you live at low altitude and your loads are light, the 4.7 is probably a little better. I plan on keeping mine a long time.
If they actually do put a small diesel in the Dakota, I'll take another look.
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Kowalski
GenIII
8/05/2007
08:53:14
| RE: new truck opinions
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.boB - if you're only hauling 3500 lbs, I think the better choice for a weekend hauler and daily driver would be the 4.7 by far. Better milage, reliability at least as good, and you can find fresher used examples. The 4.7 will pull much more than that, mine does all the time - even in mountainous terrain. Just don't be afraid to let the 4.7 rev, it was designed for that.
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.boB
Dodge Dakota
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8/05/2007
12:06:08
| RE: new truck opinions
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It's rare for me to tow below 5,000' ASL. On a stock engine, you need all the help you can get. Bigger is better.
And, I already own the 5.9 :)
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Kowalski
GenIII
8/05/2007
12:14:54
| RE: new truck opinions
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Oh, you just meant around in your yard. Sorry, I thought you were making that general recomendation for anyone. I usually pull 5500 - 6000, 4.7 works fine for that.
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.boB
Dodge Dakota
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8/05/2007
20:46:11
| RE: new truck opinions
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IMO, the best truck engine is the one that produces the most torque. Not just peak torque, but greatest area under the curve. HP numbers are strictly for marketing types, not truck types like us. If you're looking for a truck, get all the advertised dyno sheets and compare them. They are not spot on, but they are pretty close.
In 2001 when I bought my truck, the 4.7 was rather disappointing. The peak numbers were OK for an engine that size. But the torque curve was very unimpressive. Especially for OHC. OHC has a lot of potential, and it wasn't there yet. Compare that to the 5.9 of the same year, and there's no doubt. The 5.9 makes more peak torque at a lower rpm, and has much more area under the curve. The 5.9 is a clear winner.
http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a256/bobcowan/DakotaDynoSheet.jpg
The newer HO models are much better. The torque curve is fairly flat, and peaks at 310 @ 3,500. Much better area under the curve than before. But still It's peak torque is still less than the 5.9's torque just off idle. The 5.9 is still a clear winner. But the HO comes in a close second. The non-HO's are a distant third.
http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a256/bobcowan/2005DakotaDynoSheet.jpg
I towed my trailer out to Columbus last month; pretty close to sea level. Wow. That made a huge differance in performance. It was kinda fun driving the truck there, even with a trailer.
Which one is best - 4.7 or 5.9? Well, I think the clear answer from a performance perspective is the 5.9. Will the 4.7 do the job? Yeah, I think for a lot of folks it will. Especially those that live near sea level. And Kawalski is right, you can find newer examples of the 4.7. Because those that have a 5.9 in a Dak are not going to let them go until they are just about dead.
I am fortunate. I have a 5.9, and it's not dead yet.
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Kowalski
GenIII
8/06/2007
15:31:07
| RE: new truck opinions
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My point wasn't whether a 5.9 is a little stronger than the 4.7, please don't get me wrong on that. My point was just how to judge ? Do most people use ultimate performance as the determining factor in choosing the best vehicle for a weekend hauler and daily driver ? I think most also include efficiency and availability as criteria...
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