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bouncy_tigger
Dodge Dakota
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2/11/2005
13:23:01
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 Subject: Can the PCM fry my O2 sensor?
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Message:
Tryed posting this last night but it didnt seam to work?
So last week I go in to my dealer with code 51 showing and they
tell me that my O2 sensor is bad. Ok they replace it and I pay
them $300 Cnd. Then I drive off the lot and up pops code 51
again within 100 meters. So the story now is that after
contacting head office in toronto they tell me the communication
between the PCM and the O2 sensor is bad and this fryed the
sensor and I will need a new PCM!! $717 plus $100 labour plus
14% tax A total of $931 CND on top of the $300 for the new O2
sensor last week.
So the question is can a bad PCM kill off the O2 sensor?
Also the truck has a ton more engine codes since they ran the
dianostic namly.
51 A lean air/fuel mixture has been indicated by an abnormally
rich correction factor.
443 Evaporative purge flow system solenoid not working
properly
645 A/C clutch relay circuit problem.
1282 The fuel pump relay circuit seems to be having a problem.
1388 Auto shutdown relay circuit problems?
1491 Radiator fan control circuit problem (may be solid state
relays as well as other circuits).
1492 Ambient or battery temperature sensor voltage wrong
2001 QC 4x4 4.7.
Thanks in advance
Sean
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Yepper
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
2/11/2005
13:39:16
| RE: Can the PCM fry my O2 sensor?
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Message:
Sounds like bullshlt to me. Try a different stealershlt.
Think of it this way. They were wrong about the O2 sensor so why should you believe they are right about this. Alot of these stealershlts look at their customers as stupid ATM's and unfortunately, many are.
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Kowalski
GenIII
2/11/2005
15:46:11
| RE: Can the PCM fry my O2 sensor?
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Message:
Could just be the PCM isn't working right. I found a used one for my '00 4.7 for $80 American.
Lead, follow, or get out of the way
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Kowalski
GenIII
2/11/2005
16:02:17
| RE: Can the PCM fry my O2 sensor?
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Message:
Source - carpart.com - many salvage yards online.
Lead, follow, or get out of the way
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deaver
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
2/11/2005
17:33:51
| RE: Can the PCM fry my O2 sensor?
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Message:
buy the part used if u can. check canadian wreckers first and shop around, then find out if u can install it yourself. god its expensive at the dealer.
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Bob Lincoln
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
2/11/2005
18:30:27
| RE: Can the PCM fry my O2 sensor?
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Message:
51 A lean air/fuel mixture has been indicated by an abnormally
rich correction factor.
443 Evaporative purge flow system solenoid not working
properly
645 A/C clutch relay circuit problem.
1282 The fuel pump relay circuit seems to be having a problem.
1388 Auto shutdown relay circuit problems?
1491 Radiator fan control circuit problem (may be solid state
relays as well as other circuits).
1492 Ambient or battery temperature sensor voltage wrong
This tells you they misdiagnosed the problem and replaced a good O2 sensor at your expense. Go elsewhere and let someone competent and honest fix it, or dig into the problem yourself if you can. It may be a grounding issue.
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Forseti
Dodge Dakota
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2/11/2005
19:07:10
| RE: Can the PCM fry my O2 sensor?
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Message:
Just a heads up .... the PCM is considered part of the emissions system .. and should be covered under that warranty ... which if i remember is like 7 years ........ check it out
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bouncy_tigger
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
2/11/2005
19:38:58
| RE: Can the PCM fry my O2 sensor?
IP: Logged
Message:
Yep. I just called them, and I can say that I'm done with this
particular 5star dealer.
The guy laughed when I asked him if the O2 sensor was still
functioning, He explains that he would need to have the truck in
the service centre to tell me if the O2 sensor was good, The
truck was in there yesterday for diagnosing!!!
Oh and he tells me they will do me a favor and not charge me
for diagnosing the problem but the charge for the original O2
sensor fix will stand!
So I going elsewhere in the morning to have the problem re-
diagnosed by a dealer who says he will show me how to replace
it myself.
So much for the 5 Star dealer!!
Thanks for the advise
Sean.
P.s My boss had his crossfire in to this dealer to have a mirror
fixed and they gave it back to him with the door handle
disconnected!
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pcm pal
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
2/11/2005
20:32:38
| RE: Can the PCM fry my O2 sensor?
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Message:
Before you hand any money to anyone else, check to see what the Federally mandated emissions warranty is in Canada - believe (don't quote me) it is around 130,000 KM or 7 years.
Find a different dealer - the fact the code came right back on you tells me the tech threw an o2 at it without doing a proper monitor test, and didn't test drive it after the repair to see if the problem was corrected, not to mention the other plethora of codes that was ignored.
For what it's worth, it does sound PCM related - if not in the PCM itself, our friend Bob Lincoln above is correct in that it may be a grounding issue - waaaay to many codes from too many systems popping up at the same time. If it's a grounding issue, you're probably on for the repair; if it's a PCM issue, may be under warranty.
Good luck!
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bouncy_tigger
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
2/11/2005
21:42:19
| RE: Can the PCM fry my O2 sensor?
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Message:
Well the pile of codes appeared after the last visit .
The time frame went like this.
Day 1. Ball joint recall. Sway bars lubed. O2 sensor replaced.
Drove off the lot 100 meters and the code 51 came back on..no
other codes.
Day 2. sway bars relubed because they forgot to finish the job.
The cause of code 51 fault could not be found. I was asked to
return when the head office in toronto was opened (I'm in
vancouver). no other codes shown.
Day 3 Dealer had truck all day then I call and they say "Yep
Truck is ready to go" so I ask what the problem was and they
explain that it needs a new PCM and that "ready to go" means
take it out of our sight and bring back money!!
I check the computer after I have picked up the truck and
discover all the error codes.
Day 4 dealer claims that faulty PCM fryed the original O2 sensor,
and they will not charge me for the 3 hours spent on day 3
checking wiring and the PCM and that I need to give them $930
in addition to the $300 plus I paid on day one.
So I wont be going back.
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Jeep too
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
2/11/2005
22:02:05
| RE: Can the PCM fry my O2 sensor?
IP: Logged
Message:
Hey bouncy_tigger.
Your Dak has a 4.7L engine, so Jeep service departments are available to you, as well.
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Hey
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
2/12/2005
02:32:27
| RE: Can the PCM fry my O2 sensor?
IP: Logged
Message:
What is the name of the stealer?
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Kowalski
GenIII
2/12/2005
06:39:57
|  RE: Can the PCM fry my O2 sensor?
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Message:
Federal emissions warranty refers to a warranty mandated by U.S.A., whose authority of course ends as you cross the Canadian border. It would be interesting to know if Canada has anything similar.
Lead, follow, or get out of the way
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pcm pal
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
2/12/2005
10:17:16
| RE: Can the PCM fry my O2 sensor?
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Message:
Kowalski, I was referring to the Canadian federal emissions warranty......I know there is one, but just unsure of its terms. :-)
Bouncy-tigger, it's not likely that the PCM fried the O2 sensor; given the additional information you've put on the sequence of codes appearing, sounds like the PCM is slowly dying off and throwing ghost codes.
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Kowalski
GenIII
2/12/2005
11:02:52
| RE: Can the PCM fry my O2 sensor?
IP: Logged
Message:
Didn't know Canada referred to herself as a federal government, I guess that's because its a union of provinces ?
You're right; seems to be too many unrelated codes for it to be anything but the PCM.
Lead, follow, or get out of the way
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Bob Lincoln
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
2/12/2005
23:35:47
| RE: Can the PCM fry my O2 sensor?
IP: Logged
Message:
Make them explain how a PCM can 'fry' an O2 sensor. The 4-wire sensor in use nowadays has a signal wire, a ground, and the two heating wires (power and ground) for the heating element. The signal is generated by a piezoelectric effect of the O2 on the zirconium material. The heating element has 12 volts applied when the engine is cold. No damage will result by applying that voltage at any other time. I don't see how the PCM can damage it at all. The O2 has an analog voltage signal to the PCM. Even if the PCM is damaged and applies 12 volts to the signal wire, it can't damage the sensor.
They truly are a stealership.
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Hey
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
2/13/2005
02:32:02
| RE: Can the PCM fry my O2 sensor?
IP: Logged
Message:
What the fukk is the name of the fukking stealership?
OVER
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pcm pal
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
2/13/2005
20:27:03
| RE: Can the PCM fry my O2 sensor?
IP: Logged
Message:
Kowalski, hope this is better:
the "Canadian Socialist Draft-Dodger Haven Wait 6 months for an MRI" emissions warranty....... :-)
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