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DakotaOwner01
Dodge Dakota
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10/28/2004
00:49:15
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 Subject: RE: nitrogen filled tires
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rubber bands and ballons are not the same material as tires. Rubber bands are less refined and not vulcanized (important to keep rubber from dehydrating), they loose moisture over time which causes them to become brittle it has very little to do with oxygen in the air. To prove this theory to yourself place a couple rubber mands in the freezer one over night and one over a week they should get progressively more brittle and break. Freezeing it causes frost burn which is a reaction where solid water molecules become gas. Basicly freezing is simply accelerating the dehydration. Freeze drying is this process under a vacuum but I won't bore with this topic anymore. Ballons, are latex or mylar. latex has pores in it that will allow air to slowly seep out if thin enough. Mylar ballons are will stay inflated almost indefinately if the seal where they filled it is air tight, which it is typically not.
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DakotaOwner01
Dodge Dakota
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10/28/2004
00:59:13
| RE: nitrogen filled tires
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One last thing I would like to point out is much of the rubber we use today is synthetic rubber made from crude oil, no longer latex based.
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Theresa Heinz
Dodge Dakota
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10/28/2004
12:59:36
| RE: nitrogen filled tires
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Damn all those companies claiming nitrogen filled tires are superior!!
To hell with all the people that have nitrogen filled tires!!
I say Shove It! to all the companies that sell machines to fill tires with niotrogen!
They are all wrong!! Their whole business is a sham!!! They're just a pack of liars!!
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DakotaOwner01
Dodge Dakota
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10/29/2004
01:54:35
| RE: nitrogen filled tires
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don't forget to call them idiots and say they have never had a real job lol
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Floatpilot
Dodge Dakota
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10/29/2004
16:37:59
| RE: nitrogen filled tires
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Nitrogen is used in aircraft tires for the reason that it does not expand when flying at high altitude and can handle extreme temp changes. I do not see the advantage of it in passenger vehicles at all.
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slopehead
Dodge Dakota
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10/30/2004
02:47:29
| RE: nitrogen filled tires
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here is a comment from another idiot on here:
Air has small molecules that actually pass thru the rubber in a tire. Nitrogen has larger molecules.
Hey moron do you realize that "air" is 78% nitrogen?
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slopehead
Dodge Dakota
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10/30/2004
02:49:55
| RE: nitrogen filled tires
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then there is the idiot that thinks arsenic a "heavy" metal is a gas.
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slopehead
Dodge Dakota
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10/30/2004
02:53:53
| RE: nitrogen filled tires
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then there is the classic:
like i said, nitrogen filled tires will have a more steady psi than compressed air
since "air" is 78% nitrogen 21% oxygen and 1% "other" why would that be true of something that is already almost 80% made up of the stuff you preach? actually nitrogen has a far greater expansion/contraction ratio to heat then O2 does.
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DakotaOwner01
Dodge Dakota
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10/30/2004
03:19:35
| RE: nitrogen filled tires
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The only good arguement for nitrogen filled tires is the predictable expansion curve you get with a pure gas.
My next question is if you like nitrogen so much why not use argon? It is an inert, monatomic gas, that has a disgustingly stable temp, pressure curve. To top it off it is not much more expensive.
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MR2MAN
Dodge Dakota
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10/30/2004
19:55:27
|  RE: nitrogen filled tires
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Whoa there guys.
Looks like I stirred up a hornets nest.
Did a litle research and found this:
The article can be found at this link:
http://www.trucktires.com/us_eng/library/publications/periodicals/RealAnswers/03v8iss3/ra8.asp
Some more links:
http://auto.howstuffworks.com/question594.htm
http://www.toyo.com.au/tech_info11.html
http://www.mtdealer.com/t_inside.cfm?action=art_det&storyID=1207
http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO1&Sect2=HITOFF&d=PALL&p=1&u=/netahtml/srchnum.htm&r=1&f=G&l=50&s1=6,470,923.WKU.&OS=PN/6,470,923&RS=PN/6,470,923
http://www.tirelast.com/id5.html
http://www.prairiebizmag.com/article.asp?id=401
Your question has prompted me to search for a scientific explanation.
http://wine1.sb.fsu.edu/chm1045/notes/Gases/Diffuse/Gases09.htm
"The effusion rate, r, has been found to be inversely proportional to the square root of its molar mass and a lighter gas will effuse more rapidly than a heavy gas."
We know the molar mass for N2, air and O2 are 28, 29 and 32 respectively. So, N2 should actually effuse faster than air and O2.
http://www.trailerlife.com/cforum/index.cfm/fuseaction/thread/tid/14253029/gotomsg/14254472.cfm#14254472
"According to van der Waals equation for the behavior of non-ideal gasses, the a constant for N2 is 1.39 vs. 1.37 for N2/O2 mix (standard air). The b constant shows even less of a variation: 0.0391 for N2 vs. 0.0.0342 for the mix. It should be noted that the terms are both linear in the equation.
Also, plotting the PV/RT vs. pressure for 1 mole of gas shows that one must be in the pressure ranges of 100 atmospheres before appreciable differences in expansion behavior are noticed.
Given this, one would have to dismiss the arguments provided above, except perhaps the oxidizing effect provided by O2."
Some more opinions:
http://www.cartalk.com/content/columns/Archive/1997/September/05.html
"Their claim that nitrogen keeps your tire pressure more constant is actually correct. But their reasoning is wacko. It has nothing to do with diffusion of air through the rubber.
While going thru Google researching this question, I was looking thru many different forums that asked the same question. Not one of them called someone "stupid", "idiot", or an 8th grader.
People ask questions to learn, not to be belittled. Information should be shared willingly without the informer strutting his superiority of knowledge over anyone else.
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DakotaOwner01
Dodge Dakota
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10/30/2004
20:41:23
| RE: nitrogen filled tires
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PV=nRT
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