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General Dakota Board
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brodak
Dodge Dakota
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5/21/2004
01:29:25
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 Subject: mobil 1
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Message:
Is mobil 1 synthetic oil supposed to last longer than regular oil? If not, then why is it more expensive?
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another mark
Dodge Dakota
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5/21/2004
01:46:46
|  RE: mobil 1
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It costs more because that is what the market will bear. Some equate quality with price. Every oil company claims their's is the best. Bottom line is regular oil change intervals and your engine will be just fine. Personally I like and use Mobil 1. If you do a search you will find some real in depth analysis on oil and which is better than which. I've read several times where it doesn't matter which brand you use as long as you change it every 3-5k and the filter too. I believe synthetics may help to reduce friction and therefore help out slightly in MPG and wear.
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AmsoilSponsor
DakotaEnthusiast
 
5/21/2004
06:52:36
|  Mobil1 vs. Amsoil = www.american-synthetic-oil.com
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First ...
Not all oils are the same ... not all engines perform the same (even using the same oil) ... therefore, depending upon your engine, your driving habits, and your climate ... your oil will perform differently than the next guys.
Severe Driving = Pedal to the Metal Driving --- City Driving - Stop-and-Go in bumper-to-bumper Driving --- Crowded downtown Conditions --- Weather ... as in Extreme Heat or Extreme Cold --- Engine Condition --- Towing a Trailer --- Hilly or Mountain Conditions --- all affect the life expectancy of an oil.
If you believe that your oil (Mobil1) operates under severe driving conditions (see above) I would change every 3,000 miles. If most of your miles are highway miles and do not fall under the above conditions --- you could go further between changes.
Don't get me wrong, Mobil1 is a good oil. I have never discredited Mobil1 on this site. Mobil1 has the appropriate additive base to be easily changed at 5,000 mile intervals (under NORMAL driving conditions). You did not tell us what Dakota you own, or what mechanical condition ... so here is our advice. Look in the owners manual if you want and go by the manufacturers recommendations.
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Special Note: Manufacturers (when determining oil change intervals in your owners manual) must take into consideration that you MIGHT be using 69 cent ( .69 ) per quart no-name or generic "crap" when they make their Owners Manual recommendations. They are always going to try to cover their butts. That is why they publish such a low number in the Owners Manual. Mobil1 can EASILY go 5,000 miles under NORMAL driving conditions.
Special Note: Intervals are beginning to edge up in this country because owners are demanding it. Oil change intervals in Europe are between 12,000 & 15,000 miles ... of course this is with ACEA (European) Certified Oils ... which are much better than most API (American) Certified Oils. Amsoil meets and exceeds European ACEA Certifications.
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In addition to my prior comments ... the Mobil1 sold in Europe is better than the Mobil1 sold in America. Why? Two reasons. Because Americans are sold on the MYTH of 3,000 mile changes ... and companies like Mobil1 can't sell their "American" formulation for $18 a jug at Walmart. Their best formulation (ACEA Certified European) would be priced at between $8 - $12 quart in America ... right up there with oils like Schaeffers & Amsoil which excede European ACEA Standards.
It has been published that most if not all automotive manufacturers will be recommending extended drain intervals of up to 15,000 miles in the near future (it already is a recommendation in Europe, but don't forget their ACEA Certification is a lot stronger than API's (minimum) Certification here in the USA).
ALL EUROPEAN OILS ARE CERTIFIED TO A HIGHER STANDARD THAN WHAT YOU FIND "on-the-shelf" IN AMERICA. AMSOIL Synthetic Oil surpasses the North American AAMA, Japanese JASO and European ACEA oil specifications for high temperature/high shear viscosity protection.
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I try to be very clear when talking about extended drains. 10,000 mile oil change is absolutely possible. Up to a 25,000 mile interval is possible under certain conditions, but please read further for additional information. But the KEY here is that --- The 3,000 mile recommendation is overkill, especially with superior synthetic oils.
That is the only thing that really annoys me about Mobil1 ... they sell a lesser product here than they sell in Europe. Why? Are the American consumers not worthy of their BEST formulation?
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Redline, in a recently released press release, stated that some synthetic motor oils (without mentioning Amsoil) can IN FACT be used for extended oil change intervals up to 25,000 miles and perhaps beyond ... though they recommend that you don't try it with their synthetics. Thank You Redline!
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You can Request a FREE Amsoil Catalog by clicking below.
Steven Roark , Amsoil Dealer , Proud Sponsor of www.DodgeDakotas.com
AMSOIL Synthetic Motor Oils, Lubricants, Filtration, and Truck Care Products
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AmsoilSponsor
DakotaEnthusiast
5/21/2004
06:59:43
| Mobil1 vs. Amsoil = www.american-synthetic-oil.com
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Why do synthetics cost more? Because of how the fluids are made, the better additives packages, and the added costs of manufacturing.
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What ARE Synthetic Lubricants?
Synthetic fluids are manufactured, built "from the molecules up" from simpler organic compounds. This synthesis process gives Synthetic Lubricants pre-determined physical and chemical properties. Thermal and oxidative stability increases oil life, reduces deposits and controls oil thickening. High lubricity reduces heat and prevents wear. The performance characteristics of synthetic lubes are based on their tailor-made molecular structure. Synthetic oils use additives to enhance performance, rather than make up for limitations of petroleum base fluids.
The synthetic chemistry means less friction, more efficient operation, and a decrease in lubricant temperatures. This translates into better fuel economy and increased power, reduced maintenance, improved reliability, and longer-lasting engines, transmissions, differentials, etc.
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NOTE: There are TRUE Synthetics and SEMI-Synthetics (sometimes referred to as FAKE Synthetics). A "100% True Synthetic" is Group IV/Group V and a "Hydrocracked (not 100%) Synthetic" is Group III (still better than straight dino)
A true 100% synthetic oil uses either the Group IV or Group V basestock, or a mixture of the two. As a matter of fact, I don't think any of the synthetics use just one, they mix them both.
Group IV is PAOs (Polyalfaolefins) while Group V is the esters.
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Synthetic vs. Non Synthetic - Why Synthetics Work Better
In plain English, synthetic lubricants are designed to handle temperature extremes, especially heat. They reduce frictional heat and transfer heat away from critical components faster. They also resist heat breakdown much better than petroleum-based lubricants. In scientific terms, synthetic lubes have higher lubricity and higher thermal conductivity.
Conventional lubricants (often referred to as Dino, short for dinosaur) rely mainly on additives for their performance. Their petroleum base fluids are physically separated from crude oil during refining. Petroleum base fluids contain impurities of varying types and amounts (wax crystals and sulfur compounds, etc.). These impurities make the lubricant less stable, providing molecular "targets" where heat and chemical contaminants can "attack".
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Brand ????? Since I believe whole-heartedly in Synthetics ... lets begin there and talk about the top 3 mentioned on this site:
Redline is an excellent synthetic oil, but VERY pricey, and they offer no Preferred Customer Program whereby customers can receive approximately 20% off retail pricing (Amsoil does). Redline has an excellent additive package, and a high ratio of esters to PAO's. But my personal opinion ... I would not use this in a daily driver - it's viscosity tends to thin out rather quickly .
Of course I am particular to Amsoil. Amsoil has an excellent additive package, and offers extended drain intervals. FOR MORE INFORMATION ... perform a search for "Amsoil Extended Drain". Too much information to repeat every time. Amsoil can safely offer you extended oil drains up to 2 - 3 times manufacturers recommendations. I have a press release from Redline Oils where they verify that some Syntheitc Oils are good up to 25,000 miles but they don't recommend that you do it with theirs.
Mobil1 is good for an "on-the-shelf" synthetic oil, but it could be better. As stated earlier, the European Formulation for Mobil1 is much better than the U.S. Mobil1 Formulation. It is a weaker formulation in the U.S. to compete price-wise with the other "on-the-shelf" oils.
There are other 100% synthetics but not as readily available as Redline, Amsoil, and Mobil1. I mentioned these three because they are the "favorite" 100% TRUE synthetics on this site.
__________________________________________________
Steven Roark , Amsoil Dealer , Proud Sponsor of www.DodgeDakotas.com
AMSOIL Synthetic Motor Oils, Lubricants, Filtration, and Truck Care Products
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Kowalski
Dodge Dakota
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5/21/2004
15:32:55
| RE: mobil 1
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All good points; especially the point that synthetic oils are more resistant to thermal breakdown. I believe synthetics are also more resistant to "mechanical" breakdown; the shearing of larger molecules into smaller ones through stresses like going through the teeth of a gear as it meshes. Motorcycles may particularly benifit from synthetics for this reason as there can be more shearing because of the way thay are designed.
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dogliftsleg
Dodge Dakota
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5/22/2004
22:41:37
| RE: mobil 1
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Message:
and wonders:
steve said in one post:
"I have never discredited Mobil1 on this site."
then he said in another:
"NOW --- the difference in wear rates between Amsoil and Mobil1 is statistically significant,"
if that is not discrediting Mobil1 I don't know what is.
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dogliftsleg
Dodge Dakota
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5/23/2004
01:14:18
| RE: mobil 1
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Message:
and takes a piss then licks his balls then humps the neighbors poodle.
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RealDon
Dodge Dakota
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5/23/2004
08:39:35
| RE: mobil 1
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Message:
For Steve to say the differences in wear rates
is statistically significant is not to discredit.
from www.dictionary.com
dis·cred·it
To damage in reputation; disgrace.
To cause to be doubted or distrusted.
To refuse to believe.
None of those definitions apply to Steve's comment
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