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General Dakota Board
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Justi
Dodge Dakota
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12/17/2003
21:03:09
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 Subject: Synthetic Oil Change Interval
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I have an '03 QC 4x4 with the 4.7L and 5 speed auto tranny at 6k miles. I am putting serious consideration into switching to a synthetic oil but have a question. Some synthetic oil companies (AMSOil) claim that you can go upwards of 25k miles between oil changes with a filter change at 12k miles. This seems a bit long to me. Two questions. A, what interval do you synthetic users change your oil? and B, does exetending your interval beyond factory recommendations void your warranty in any way?
Also as bonus questions, what brand synthetic do you use? Is there anything special I need to do to switch to synthetic such as a flush, a specific amount of miles, etc...
I realize that this is well covered territory on this board but almost every thread on the topic takes off on a tangent. I'm looking for current input from the people that know, which is all of you. And yes AMS guy, I'm interested in your input as well. To avoid everyone complaining about a possible long response you can feel free to email me any data you may have. THANKS A LOT!!
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RAT
Dodge Dakota
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12/17/2003
21:09:36
|  RE: Synthetic Oil Change Interval
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I usually change at about 6 grand, somtimes sooner. But I might be paranoid. I use Mobil 1 10w 30. I like to see clean oil most of the time.
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AmsoilSponsor
DakotaEnthusiast
12/18/2003
13:02:48
|  Amsoil and Synthetic Oil Change Interval
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I try to be very clear when talking about extended drains. 10,000 mile oil change is absolutely possible. Up to a 25,000 mile interval is possible under certain conditions, but please read further for additional information. But the KEY here is that --- The 3,000 mile recommendation is overkill, especially with superior synthetic oils.
I know it's hard to believe, but there are a few things that I would like to clarify. Amsoil has been in the oil industry for 30 years. Due to Amsoil's superior synthetic composition and advanced performance additives, AMSOIL performs much longer than do conventional petroleum and other synthetic motor oils. No other major oil manufacturer matches AMSOIL's 25,000-mile or one-year drain interval recommendations (whichever comes FIRST, changing the filter every six months).
However, the 25,000 mile /1 year that is on the back of the bottle is NOT an absolute! One must realize that is for non-severe service (highway miles where you have stable operating conditions) and that the indicated drain interval also has a time period of 1 year maximum as well.
***** READ THIS PLEASE EVERYONE: Under a combination of city and highway circumstances, AMSOIL recommends up to 2 or 3 times longer, it means up to 2 or 3 times the equipment manufacturer's recommendation (If your owners manual states 3k miles , then you can change at 9k, and if your owners manual states 5k then 12-15k changes would be alright based on driving habits ... the harder you drive, the sooner the change). Proper filtration is also very important. AMSOIL SDF Oil Filters must be changed at least every 6 months regardless of miles driven.
Notice: Modifications to engine will change service intervals.
Notice: More frequent service may be required under severe service operating conditions.
Notice: For drain interval beyond 3x manufacturers recommendations (especially the 25k change) ---
Regular oil analysis is recommended for establishing drain intervals.
AMSOIL --- 30 years of manufacturing oil and mountains of data and tests make these clains possible.
Let me know if you need additional information.
--------------------------------------------------
Steven Roark , Amsoil Dealer , Proud Sponsor of www.DodgeDakotas.com
AMSOIL Synthetic Motor Oils, Lubricants, Filtration, and Truck Care Products
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Kowalski
Dodge Dakota
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12/18/2003
16:11:30
| RE: Synthetic Oil Change Interval
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I go 7500 on the Mobil 1.
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TexasTodd
Dodge Dakota
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12/18/2003
16:35:40
|  RE: Synthetic Oil Change Interval
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LIke the K man,
I go 5K-7500 on my MObil 1, 4.7, 5spd
looks a little dark when it comes out. For several K after change, still looks clear, hard to read, the few times I check it, if ever.
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AmsoilSponsor
DakotaEnthusiast
12/18/2003
20:10:44
| RE: Synthetic Oil Change Interval
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Message:
Not all oils are the same ... not all engines perform the same (even using the same oil) ... therefore, depending upon your engine, your driving habits, and your climate ... your oil will perform differently than the next guys.
Severe Driving - City Driving - Stop and Go Driving --- Extreme Heat - Extreme Cold - Engine Condition - all affect the life expectancy of an oil.
Mobil1
Do you commute in your Dakota or do you DRIVE your Dakota? (as in pushing the pedal to the metal). 7500 miles on Mobil1 is as far as I would push the envelope even if you drove like my grandmother. I have seen dozens of UOA's (Used Oil Analysis) whereby Mobil1 started thinning out around 6000 miles. NOTE: Mobil1 is a good oil ... and for those of you using it change your oil at 5000 miles please.
__________________________________________________
Further clarification of my earlier statement:
First, we all know 3k oil changes are overkill, but to make a "blanket statement" that Amsoil can go 25k miles is wrong. Severe Driving - City Driving - Stop and Go Driving --- Extreme Heat - Extreme Cold - Engine Condition - all affect the life expectancy of an oil.
Amsoil Clearly States --- that you can extend your oil change interval "up to 2-3 times the manufacturers recommendation" using Amsoil Synthetic Motor Oil. The 25k extended drain is under "ideal conditions" (25k or one year whichever comes first - changing the filter at 12.5k miles or 6 months whichever comes first) - after establishing your vehicles ability to do so performing Used Oil Analysis.
Amsoil, with 30 years of laboratory testing, and millions of highway miles of testing ... have determined that the 25,000 mile and/or 1 year (whichever comes first) extended drain can be accomplished --- under normal driving conditions --- and in a mechanically sound engine. *** Redline (in a Press Release and on their website) recently confirmed that Synthetic Oils can go 25k miles between change, but Redline does not recommend it with their oils ***
*** Note: On the back of the Amsoil bottle, and in their literature, Amsoil states that you can extend your oil change interval up to 2-3 times the manufacturers recommendation. If you are going to be driving 25,000 miles and/or 1 year (whichever comes first) between oil changes (changing the filter at 6 months or 12,500 miles), you should perform a UOA to determine if your engine (along with your driving conditions) are suitable for extended drain. Otherwise, you can certainly extend your drains 2-3 times longer than stated in your owners manual.
Repeat --- Amsoil Clearly States --- that you can extend your oil change interval "up to 2-3 times the manufacturers recommendation" using Amsoil Synthetic Motor Oil.
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Steven Roark , Amsoil Dealer , Proud Sponsor of www.DodgeDakotas.com
AMSOIL Synthetic Motor Oils, Lubricants, Filtration, and Truck Care Products
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Anthony
Dodge Dakota
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12/18/2003
21:05:22
| RE: Synthetic Oil Change Interval
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I'm running Mobil 1 5w-30 in my Dak too.
I've talked to Mobil 1 about extended oil drain they say change as the manual states or once a year. I'm changing my oil every 7500 miles and oil filter change at 3750 miles.
Anthony
www.geocities.com/dak2nv/
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Curtis Dreese
Dodge Dakota
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12/19/2003
02:09:11
| RE: Synthetic Oil Change Interval
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I run Mobil 1 5W-30 October thru March. Then I switch to Mobil 1 15W-50 April thru September. Probably only put about 4,500 miles on each 6 month period. I used to run regular dino oil and changed every three months but figure the synthetic can easily go double the time. Now I don't have to change oil 4 times a year--just twice.
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BigBlueQC
GenIII
12/19/2003
12:25:14
| RE: Synthetic Oil Change Interval
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Message:
Justi, my answer may help convince you that extended drains are possible.
When I first bought my truck I had already sold myself that I was going to do extended drain intervals while using AMSOIL. I had seen testing done by a friend of mine in a lab on AMSOIL that had already convinced me AMSOIL was a superior product years ago. I first started using the "regular" as I call it AMSOIL synthetic 5w-30. With OIl Analysis before each filter change I was able to get approx. 19,000 to 20,000 miles between changes.
I then switched to the AMSOIL series 2000 0w-30 as that product claimed even longer drain intervals(UP TO 35,000 miles). In MY 4.7L, that wasn't the case. I haven't been able to more thatn 10,000 miles before changing. Apparantly, the 4.7L's create a lot of internal heat and the series 2000 isn't as stable at higher temps. as the "regular" grade is. I am going to switch back to the "regular" grade, but to 10w-30.
I have continually done Oil Analysis before each filter change so I know what's going on with the oil. That is the key to "safe" extended drain intervals. I also just found out that the SDF26 oil fliter from AMSOIL, which is almost twice as long as the SDF42, the std size filter for the 4.7, fits fine. I am going to start using that next change.
Hope this info is helpful to you. E-mail me if you have any further questions.
2002 QC 4x4 Sport Plus, 4.7L, auto, Patriot Blue, Tire & Handling group,
Heavy Duty Service group, Leer cap w/out windows, Mopar Step bars and roof rack, Rhino liner in bed and on step bars, Pace Edwards Power Tailgate lock
3.55 rear, 4-wheel anti-lock brakes, all possible fluids are AMSOIL
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Justi
Dodge Dakota
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12/26/2003
22:34:10
| RE: Synthetic Oil Change Interval
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Message:
Great info guys and I really appreciate it! I've ordered a catalog from AMSoil so I'll see what happens. Thanks a lot!
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Dr. D
Dodge Dakota
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12/27/2003
15:40:29
| RE: Synthetic Oil Change Interval
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Message:
I change my oil as per the recommendations of AMSOIL
which just so happens to be once a year with a filter change
at six months or 12,000 miles.
When I was using Mobil1 I was changing my oil somewhere
between 6 - 7,000 miles.
Dr. D
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AmsoilSponsor
DakotaEnthusiast
12/27/2003
17:23:50
| Amsoil and Synthetic Oil Change Interval
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Message:
Dr. D.,
Oil Analysis is important to determine your particular vehicle's ability to go 25k miles between oil changes using Amsoil. Once you establish the fact that your vehicle can go 25k miles between changes then you are fine.
Without UOA's, Amsoil can easily be extended to between 2-3 times manufacturers recommendations. Manufacturers use the "lowest common denominator" whenb determining oil change intervals, should the owner use the cheapest oil with the weakest additive package.
For the record, not only can a UOA tell you that your oil is capable of continued service, it can also detect existing and/or pending problems with your engine.
----------------------------------------------
Oil Analysis (VOA = Virgin Oil Analysis, UOA = Used Oil Analysis):
A UOA (Used Oil Analysis) is a trend analysis "per vehicle" and reports will be different "per vehicle". You can not compare across brands or between vehicles. UOA's are not used to determine "oil quality"
Oil analysis can detect:
Fuel dilution of lubrication oil
Dirt contamination in the oil
Antifreeze in the oil
Excessive bearing wear
Misapplication of lubricants
Some wear is normal, but abnormal levels of a particular material can give an early warning of impending problems and possibly prevent a major breakdown.
Early detection can:
Reduce repair bills
Reduce catastrophic failures
Increase machinery life
Reduce non-scheduled downtime
Early detection with oil analysis can allow for corrective action such as repairing an air intake leak before major damage occurs. Probably one of the major advantages of an oil analysis program is being able to anticipate problems and schedule repair work to avoid downtime during a critical time of use.
Oil analysis involves sampling and analyzing oil for various properties and materials to monitor wear and contamination in an engine, transmission or hydraulic system. Sampling and analyzing on a regular basis establishes a baseline of normal wear and can help indicate when abnormal wear or contamination is occurring.
Oil analysis works like this. Oil that has been inside any moving mechanical apparatus for a period of time reflects the exact condition of that assembly. Oil is in contact with engine or mechanical components as wear metallic trace particles enter the oil. These particles are so small they remain in suspension. Many products of the combustion process also will become trapped in the circulating oil. The oil becomes a working history of the machine.
Particles caused by normal wear and operation will mix with the oil. Any externally caused contamination also enters the oil. By identifying and measuring these impurities, you get an indication of the rate of wear and of any excessive contamination. An oil analysis also will suggest methods to reduce accelerated wear and contamination.
The typical oil analysis tests for the presence of a number of different materials to determine sources of wear, find dirt and other contamination, and even check for the use of appropriate lubricants.
--------------------------------------------------
Steven Roark , Amsoil Dealer , Proud Sponsor of www.DodgeDakotas.com
AMSOIL Synthetic Motor Oils, Lubricants, Filtration, and Truck Care Products
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Dr. D
Dodge Dakota
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12/28/2003
08:44:21
| RE: Synthetic Oil Change Interval
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Hey Steven,
It is always an honor to have you reply or comment about one of my post.
According to AMSOIL ... If I use their filter and their oil and I have a "mechanicaly sound" vehicle, then I am able to extend my oil change intervals to 25,000 miles or one year (whichever comes first) and, I must change my filter at half of that interval or six months (whichever comes first).
From what I understand about AMSOIL is that if I want to go beyond 25,000 miles on an oil change I must use oil analysis, by-pass filtration, FLOWZAIR air filter etc.
Dr. D
p.s.
Please note that I use the 25,000 mile PAO based Synthetic with the "25,000 mile" change interval not the XL 7500 "7,500 mile" oil.
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