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JohnJ
Dodge Dakota
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6/28/2003
14:28:50
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 Subject: What is C.A.F.E. ???
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Subject says it all. I here it mentioned all the time but do not have a 100% understanding of it. Enlighten me guys! How does it affect the performance and mpg of my Dak?
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WOOT
Dodge Dakota
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6/28/2003
14:31:31
|  RE: What is C.A.F.E. ???
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It's where you go to eat, its short for cafeteria
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Cliff
Dodge Dakota
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6/28/2003
14:40:11
| RE: What is C.A.F.E. ???
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Cafe is a consumer nightmare. Manufactures look for any way possable to increase MPG. SO this means low tension rings, three ring setup instead of 5 ring setup, piston rings near the top of the piston, narrow mains to ruduce friction, lighter valve train......These things all hurt long term durability. All company's are doing this .......import and domestics. As they are reduceing NVH and fuel consumption they are boosting output and raiseing operating temps. This is all thanks to Cafe. Some companys do this better then others. I could highlight some pro's and con's of some of the stuff Toyota has done with it's new Z series engines. Some of it is really neat and some is just disapointing.
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AmsoilSponsor
DakotaEnthusiast
 
6/28/2003
14:43:16
| RE: What is C.A.F.E. ???
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The acronym C.A.F.E or CAFE, means Corporate Average Fuel Economy and it means that for all vehicles that a manufacturer sells, the average fuel economy must meet a minimum level. Since some of the Domestic companies sell trucks and SUV's by the boatload, and they get horrible gas mileage, they have to sell a similar number of miserly cars to balance it out. It has limited effect on the Dakota, except that it prevents it from being the BEAST that it could be.
Steven Roark , Amsoil Dealer , Proud Sponsor of www.DodgeDakotas.com
AMSOIL Synthetic Motor Oils, Lubricants, Filtration, and Truck Care Products
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Raymond
Dodge Dakota
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6/28/2003
14:57:12
| RE: What is C.A.F.E. ???
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Correct Steven, and may I add ...... Each year the Government requires major automoble companies to meet minimum fuel economy standards for the complete line combined. The average is 27 +/- mpg for this year, 2003. It is ok to sell a Dakota with an average MPG of 16 as long as you sell enough cars that get better than 30 mpg to average out to 27 mpg with the Dak. So if you sell one Dak that gets an average of 16 mpg and sell 6 cars that get an average of 30+ mpg, then you would have an average fleet MPG of 28. Or a Corporate Average Fuel Economy (CAFE) of 28 mpg.
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graphiteRT
R/T
6/28/2003
15:40:20
| RE: What is C.A.F.E. ???
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Steven, it isn't CAFE per se, that limits the Dakota in performance, it's emissions requirements that slow it down(HC and NOX considerations). Somewhat related, but not exactly. If emissions reqs were relaxed, you can actually increase peformance and increase gas mileage at the same time(up to a point) on the legacy 5.2 and 5.9 stuff. The Magnum motors are dated, generally inefficient designs that have to be detuned to keep the EPA happy. Some of the undesirable tranny behaviors and controls would be credited to CAFE, so I guess you can say it does impact performance, but not nearly the extent of the detuned fuel and spark mapping.
Take a look at the new Superchips tuner for a prime example of how this improved performance/mileage deal can be done.
Bob
'01 Graphite CC R/T, MP headers, Magnaflow muffler into 'Cuda style exhaust, M1 2bbl, ported 2.02 R/T heads, custom grind cam, Crower SS rockers, Paxton Novi2000, Boyd's 20s w/Dunlop SP9000s, Featured in April '03 Sport Truck, Viper 4 wheel discs
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AmsoilSponsor
DakotaEnthusiast
6/29/2003
09:33:01
|  RE: What is C.A.F.E. ???
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point taken ... graphiteRT,
However, with current engine designs and the use of petroleum to power our vehicles, we need to keep those emission requirements intact so we can breath a little easier.
I could go "all political on you here" and we could talk of how American Industry is moving overseas so they can operate inefficient industries burning coal without being subject to the EPA ... forcing us little guys to drive "restricted" trucks ... but we will leave that to the "off-topic" board.
I agree with you, and I was along the same thought line of your comment " undesirable tranny behaviors and controls would be credited to CAFE" when I made my comment ... which does contribute to underperformance.
Steven Roark , Amsoil Dealer , Proud Sponsor of www.DodgeDakotas.com
AMSOIL Synthetic Motor Oils, Lubricants, Filtration, and Truck Care Products
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Franky
Dodge Dakota
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6/29/2003
09:54:22
| RE: What is C.A.F.E. ???
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CAFE.........really means........i know this one.......that.........the......um....is......FRENCH FOR COFEE!!!..............man.... as if you couldnt figure that out!!!!!!DAH
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m
Dodge Dakota
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6/29/2003
11:01:29
| RE: What is C.A.F.E. ???
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Californians
Are
Fukcen
environazis!
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ROTFLAFAO
Dodge Dakota
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6/29/2003
11:07:12
|  RE: What is C.A.F.E. ???
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m
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JustinCase
Dodge Dakota
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6/29/2003
11:34:19
| RE: What is C.A.F.E. ???
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Cars, trucks, etc... fall into one of three categories:
Category 1: Passenger Cars - self explanatory
Category 2: Light Trucks - Pickups, SUV's, and Vans (INCLUDES minivans) under 8500 GVW
Category 3: Medium duty and up - anything over 8500 GVW - most 3/4 ton and up pickups, vans, and SUV's
Category 1: All vehicles that a manufacturer sells here must average 27 mpg overall. Miss the target = big $ penalties. Has not changed for over a decade.
Category 2: All vehicles a manufacturer sells here must average 20.7 mpg overall. Miss the target = big $ penalties. Also has not changed for a very long time. Some controversy on whether or not minivans should be included here, but for now they are classified as light trucks. PT cruiser is also in this category (don't ask why), but Chrysler needed these to balance off the trucks. Puts a new light on the mini-utes, doesn't it?
Category 3: No CAFE limits apply here due to the varying duty cycles of the engines in this class that are assumed to actually be doing real work. Emissions do still apply, but less restrictive than the under 8500 GVW category.
Personally, I don't think the CAFE limits are the end of the world. Anything new pushes out of our comfort zone (witness the backlash against 5w20 oils - yet we haven't had mass reports of failures to date). With CAFE limits stagnant for so long, we have (in case you've missed it) been engaged in quite a little power war. The numbers we pull out of engines these days are mind boggling, and yet we still get the fuel mileage too. Perhaps its time to bump the CAFE numbers a bit to promote some more thought on the fuel economy side instead of the power side?
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graphiteRT
R/T
6/29/2003
18:43:03
| RE: What is C.A.F.E. ???
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Steven, I'm in no way suggesting CAFE reqs should be relaxed or removed. If anything they should be forced up. The manufacturers will kick and scream, cry poor, mobilize the lobbyists.....but in the end they would make efforts to comply.
It's all about the bottom line.
Bob
'01 Graphite CC R/T, MP headers, Magnaflow muffler into 'Cuda style exhaust, M1 2bbl, ported 2.02 R/T heads, custom grind cam, Crower SS rockers, Paxton Novi2000, Boyd's 20s w/Dunlop SP9000s, Featured in April '03 Sport Truck, Viper 4 wheel discs
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Dirk Diggler
Dodge Dakota
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6/29/2003
19:01:19
| RE: What is C.A.F.E. ???
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What about letting the market place decide? All goverment regs do is create messes like we have with CAFE. If the markets were truly opened up and liberalized, I'm sure things would work out.
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KennyJ
Dodge Dakota
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6/18/2004
06:40:45
| RE: What is C.A.F.E. ???
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Hey guys, I'm new here. Did a search for Dakota and C.A.F.E. and mileage and would up here. I never knew this site existed. I'm buying my first Dakota this weekend or maybe next. I'll be back I'm sure with lots of questions. Just wanted to drop a note and say hi.
KennyJ
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dakfour
GenI
6/18/2004
10:59:53
|  RE: What is C.A.F.E. ???
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CAFE means coffee in portuguese...he,he,he...
Dak 1999 2.5l TURBO
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01Motorsport
Dodge Dakota
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6/18/2004
20:41:54
|  RE: What is C.A.F.E. ???
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More bad news...EGR valves are making a comeback.
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Bob Lincoln
Dodge Dakota
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6/18/2004
21:52:09
| RE: What is C.A.F.E. ???
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Don't tell Larry. He still doesn't believe they exist.
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