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BAD1
Dodge Dakota
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9/16/2003
15:47:23
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 Subject: RE: Feds invesitgate Durango ball joints
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I don't know where you guys get your information. You all have way too much time on your hands to complain about stupid stuff. Dodge makes GREAT vehicles. I don't care what you say.
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JIMS
Dodge Dakota
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9/24/2003
13:53:52
|  RE: Feds invesitgate Durango ball joints
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I only have a few Comments - Some for the Chevy Dealership owner. Why on earth if you own a Chevy Dealership Do you drive a Dodge? What rational minded Dealership owner would get on a site like this and talk complete garbage. Its just unprofessional.
Look people we are talking about mass produced vehicles, there will be problems. It happens even in NASCAR. If the world were a perfect place we would own one car for life.
I personally switched this year from ford to dodge even though my ford made it 240,000 miles with very little repairs. Im extremely pleased with my dodge it runs well drives well. Your going to have problems with any vehicle. If you take car of it and regularly maintain things and not treat it like its a M1A tank then it will treat you well.
1 more point, even if we all had to replace ball joints, it would still be worth it. Ball joints are cheap stop whinning.
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Dakota 1
Dodge Dakota
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9/24/2003
22:21:55
|  RE: Feds invesitgate Durango ball joints
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I'd just like to know where I could get a greasable upper ball joint for my 2000 dakota. All the parts house around here either don't list them or say they are on back order and then never get any.
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dkr8611
Dodge Dakota
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9/29/2003
10:18:48
| RE: Feds invesitgate Durango ball joints
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From what I have read, order the moog ball joints listed for the 99 models. They are supposed to work fine.
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Chinstrap
Dodge Dakota
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10/27/2003
20:36:12
| RE: Feds invesitgate Durango ball joints
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Just a quick note. Ball joints are cheap, but the labor is not. Case and point. 99 Dodge dakota. Have put $4500 into it just to keep it on the road in the last two and a half years. That to me is crap. The only good thing about my truck is the 318 engine--probably one of the best motors ever made. Unfortunately almost every other moving part has had to be replaced. And this is not a misused truck---it is well kept. No off-roading. no excessive use. Had to get the transfer care overhauled--gearbox worked on twice, water pump, and last but not least upper and lower front x2 ball joints and bushings. Now, to me that isn't cheap, and that is infact a problem on a 99 truck. Do they not make anything out of steel anymore? Dodge's are the best looking vehicles out there. Underneath is a different story.
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sahara
Dodge Dakota
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10/29/2003
21:02:14
| RE: Feds invesitgate Durango ball joints
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Since my 1999 Durango would not pass PA State Inspection due to a bad upper ball joint and tie rod end, I e-mailed Dodge and complained. My truck only has 25,000 miles on it. Within 2 days I received a call from Customer Service. They requested a copy of my cancelled check and bill from the service center that performed the work. Within one week I received a check to cover the cost of parts and labor.
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Mayberry
Dodge Dakota
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10/30/2003
09:24:40
| RE: Feds invesitgate Durango ball joints
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Is this ball joint situation limited to 4WD Dakotas/Durangos? Are 2WD vehicles included?
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Dakotamud
Dodge Dakota
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10/30/2003
21:57:39
| RE: Feds invesitgate Durango ball joints
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1999 upper ball joints work on 2000's and up, but are not ment for them. The rivet holes in the 2000's are larger then the supplied bolts for the 99's. It's safer to go with the ball joints made for the 2000's. They have a different part number. Go with MOOG.
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AmsoilSponsor
DakotaEnthusiast
11/02/2003
18:29:18
|  Amsoil Sponsor - Ball Joint Investigation - CBS
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There was a report on CBS October 27, 2003 about ball joint failure shortly after truck reaches 30k miles (and maybe you can find it in the archives on their website) --- but how much did CBS "play it up"? Chrysler will not issue a recall and is a therefore the subject of a class action lawsuit.
Here is a different take.
If NBC had aired the special they would have worked some explosions into the story! Remember when they did this once for "effects"? Maybe CBS will hire the NBC Dateline pyrotechnic professionals to rig charges of C4 to the ball joints next time.
My concern --- "How" and "Why" does the failure occur? ... and why haven't they done something about it?
D/C will not do anything until they are forced to by the courts or a few hundred people die due to a failure.
Steven Roark , Amsoil Dealer , Proud Sponsor of www.DodgeDakotas.com
AMSOIL Synthetic Motor Oils, Lubricants, Filtration, and Truck Care Products
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BIGTYMER
Dodge Dakota
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11/04/2003
08:51:35
| RE: Feds invesitgate Durango ball joints
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chinstrap I'm sorry to hear you've had such bad luck. Seems to me though for every 1 person who has problems you'll find 10 that have nothing go wrong (balljoints excluded) I've had my truck for 2 1/2 years and the only thing I've replaced was a battery, the fan belt, and I finally need wiper blades... Keep in mind mine is 4wd and I use and ofted abuse it. When it's all said and done though I hit the key and she fires right up. Put it in gear and away I go. EVERY TIME
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jvc
Dodge Dakota
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11/04/2003
11:17:41
| RE: Feds invesitgate Durango ball joints
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ive had upper / lower ball joints / inner tie rod end replaced at 40000 miles not to mention premaure tire wear due to alignment problem . is this fair ,i dont think so , Chrysler should at least pay for some of it
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Harland
Dodge Dakota
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12/22/2003
12:11:07
|  RE: Feds invesitgate Durango ball joints
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I saw the most recent CBS news report on the Durango and Dakota upper balljoint failures. I just took my 1999 2WD Durango w/60,000 miles for a check and the ball joints were worn to the point of breakage. I caught it just in time! I am going to keep the balljoints to show. There is definitely a problem here. Get yours checked now!
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Mr Happy
Dodge Dakota
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12/23/2003
16:38:30
|  RE: Feds invesitgate Durango ball joints
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JasonB wrote:
Dodge Dakota
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8/18/2003
12:34:57
RE: Feds invesitgate Durango ball joints
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There is often a fine line between "need to be addressed or recalled by the manufacturer" vs "common failure but still up to the vehicle owner". No one on this site is qualified (as far as I can tell) to make that determination. No one at a dealership is allowed to make that determination. What amazes me is how many vehicle owners think they are qualified to make that determination. Then, some of these same people think the dealer is responsible because they said there is no problem that they are aware of.
Here is the deal people, you (the vehicle owner) are responsible for everything that happens to your vehicle until (1) there is a law that states otherwise (2) you have a printed warranty from the manufacturer that states otherwise, or (3) there is a recall that changes the responsibility back to the manufacturer."
This guy must not own one, he must work in the back of the dealership....
My spoof on the same take:
I just don't know why all of you are unhappy with failures on your trucks. Mine looks real sweet sitting in the driveway. No one can tell the right front wheel bearing failed, the left motor mount was never bolted to the block, the transmission failed at 50,000 (and it's a manual), and now it just doesn't plain start at 72,000 miles. But that's okay. I wasn't looking for a vehicle when I bought it. I thought having a $25,000 pretty yard gnome would impress my neighbors. So I went to the yard gnome dealership, signed myself up for $30,000 of debt and parked it in my driveway. All my neighbors are impressed... first yard gnome they had ever seen that didn't come with four pumice blocks to prop it up with. With the 5' 3" bed it makes a great bird bath, too!
So... why are you all so unhappy with your yard gnomes? Is it because the dealer told you that's the way a proper yard gnome should act? Heck, you should have bought the extended yard gnome warranty. With the warranty, the yard gnome dealership guarantees he'll tell you that is by design and the proper way for a yard gnome to act. Without the warranty, they'll tell you to go to a Toyota dealership and get a Toyota truck to haul cement home in to make a girlfriend for your yard gnome.
Sheesh... No more Dodges for me. Too bad I selected a Dodge for my first new vehicle. Why by someone elses problems when you can spend 6 years finncing your own set of problems?a
My Datsun 280ZX is now 21 years old and still runs sweet...
Ask Dodge why THEY can't pull that off. I know why, it is the decision process used by the executives and CFO to increase their profit margins. Produce less, price higher and use the cheapest materials. Cheap materials insure the limited life expectancy of the product insuring th ecustomer will have to buy another, but will they? Lee Iacoca would have had a different approach.
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Kevin
Dodge Dakota
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12/25/2003
20:54:26
| RE: Feds invesitgate Durango ball joints
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Soooooooooo...I have been looking online and around the local autoshops for over a week now and can barely find squat about Moog or TRW ball joints for a 2001 Quadcab 4x4. Someone said Summit Racing, but I can't find anything on their website for the 2000+ models.
People, I don't care what it costs to get this truck fixed and fixed right. Everyone says get Moog balljoints...but where do I get them from? I have only found one company that claims to have the lowers in stock and the uppers coming in the first week of January...and that is only if TRW delivers on time...it's just a maybe.
Can anyone tell me where to find Moog or TRW ball joints for a 2001 4x4?
My truck has started to "pop" under hard braking. The clock is ticking...and I now know that I'm driving a time bomb.
Pleeeeeeeeeeease help!!! :o)
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CZB
Dodge Dakota
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12/25/2003
23:49:30
| RE: Feds invesitgate Durango ball joints
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I was checking out the ongoing vehicle investigations on the NHTSA website for 2002 Durangos (nothing listed for the Dakotas yet). They have 10 investigations going on, all began 19 November of this year. According to the report, Dodge has replaced the original ball joint supplier, TRW, with New Castle Machining and Forge. The point is it's probably best to avoid replacing with TRW, since it manufactured the original defective part. Your call, since I'm sure they manufactured them to Chrysler's specs.
Chrysler is claiming the problem is caused by water getting in the joint and washing out the lubricant. CBS news announced during it's coverage that Dakotas had been added to the investigations, but it wasn't listed on the site. The report lists 28 complaints.
It can be viewed at: http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/problems/defect/defectsearch.cfm
News reports about the complaints can be viewed at: http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2003/10/27/eveningnews/main580233.shtml, http://news4colorado.com/nationworld/topstories_story_353074445.html, AND http://consumeraffairs.com/news03/durango_probe2.html
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DARREN
Dodge Dakota
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12/26/2003
09:35:44
|  RE: Feds invesitgate Durango ball joints
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I DEFINATELY HAVE THE POPING NOISE GOING ON WITH MY 2000 4WD DAKOTA. IT IS PRETTY FRUSTRATING HEARING ALL THE PEOPLE WITH THE SAME ISSUE AND NOTHING BEING DONE ABOUT IT. I GUESS I WILL HOLD AND MY BREATH THE STEERING WHEEL VERY TIGHTLY I MIGHT ADD, UNTIL SOMETHING IS DECIDED.
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Kevin
Dodge Dakota
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12/26/2003
23:29:12
| RE: Feds invesitgate Durango ball joints
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Water getting in the joint and washing the lubricant out?
I live in southern New Mexico...we don't have water here. It only rains like half a dozen times a year and we hardly ever have to wash our cars around here. I can't see how they expect us to believe such a hoaky excuse for premature ball joint failure.
Besides, if they used a quality grease and seal then water wouldn't be able to get into the joint in the first place.
I heard that the aftermarket TRW ball joints came with a lifetime warranty, but I'll make absolutely sure of it before I consider purchasing them as replacements. If this weren't such a serious problem I'd make an attempt to laugh at all of this.
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NICK
Dodge Dakota
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12/27/2003
18:11:25
| RE: Feds invesitgate Durango ball joints
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ARE THESE MADE IN THAT (OTHER)COUNTRY.YOU KNOW DOWN SOUTH.
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DodgeFixer
Dodge Dakota
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1/02/2004
07:09:14
| RE: Feds invesitgate Durango ball joints
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I have been a suspenion mechanic for over 30 years. 20 yrs at independent frontend repair shops and 10 yrs at Ford. In the seventies, the most repaired frontends, were Chrysler products. In the eighties, the most repaired frontends, were Chrysler products. In the nineties , the most repaired frontends, were Chrysler products. Does anyone see a pattern here ?
GO TO YOUR MECHANIC BEFORE YOU BUY A NEW CAR . . . NOT AFTER ! ! !
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Pike
Dodge Dakota
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1/04/2004
19:56:27
| RE: Feds invesitgate Durango ball joints
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In response to JasonB's post that said...
"Here is the deal people, you (the vehicle owner) are responsible for everything that happens to your vehicle until (1) there is a law that states otherwise (2) you have a printed warranty from the manufacturer that states otherwise, or (3) there is a recall that changes the responsibility back to the manufacturer."
The simple fact is that companies may be liable for repairs without having to go through anything on JasonB's list. If a problem is the result of normal wear on a vehicle, then we, as consumers, are on our own. However, when a problem occurs at a far greater rate, this may be the result of a defect in the product's design or manufacture. When this is the case, the seller/manufacturer is legally obligated to make the consumer whole by replacing/fixing the defective part/item.
This presents two problems. First, assuming there IS a defect, what makes the company begin the recall? Like many other issues in the law, just because somebody is legally obligated to take an action, they may not do so unitl somebody sues and gets a court order forcing them to do it. So, assuming there is a design/manufacturing flaw in the ball joints, D/C is obligated to fix them. BUT, because of the financial cost involved, they probably won't do one unless the're forced to. Alternatively, if the recall would save them money on predicted damages from personal injuries related to the defect, that would also motivate them to take action.
The second problem is drawing the line between failures that occur as a result of normal wear and tear and those that result from a defect of some sort. Certainly, such a failure may occur after a significant amount of time and use. However, in the case of the Durango/Dakota ball joints, trying to characterize these failures as "normal wear and tear" is assinine. What separates this defect from others is how QUICKLY it happens, and how OFTEN it happens.
The Speed:
When you read reports of failure occuring a less than 15,000 miles, that is not normal wear and tear. It is happening too soon.
The Rate:
Parts wear out. It happens. It's normal. But when it happens as often as it does with the Durango, something else is happening. The NHTSA has received nearly 400 complaints about Durango ball joints failing. The Exlorer (of which there are far more on the road) has received 12. The Blazer? 11. The Grand Cherokee? Zero. If it happens to a few vehicles, it may be normal wear. When it happens this often, it is indicative of a greater problem.
The punchline is that the speed and rate at which these ball joints are failing tell us that the cause is not normal. It is a defect. Daimler Chrysler, therefore, is obligated to fix this problem. Whether or not they choose to meet their obligation remains to be seen.
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