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Skylar Sutton
Dodge Dakota
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9/01/2005
21:55:19
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 Subject: (2) 8's or (1) 10?
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Semi-related to my other post, but worthy of it's own topic.
I ran some measurements on this box... I can either fit one Solo Baric 10" (L5 or L7) or two Solo Baric 8" (again, L5 or L7). Power's not an issue, I need a new amp either way.
It's been so long since I did any audio work or research, what's the general concensious?
Please... no ricers ("YoU ShOuLd GeT FiZoRe 15"'s BoI!") only people with real opinions. *obligitory smilie* =)
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GB2000
GenIII
9/01/2005
22:39:03
|  RE: (2) 8's or (1) 10?
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Since you're using the space where the center console was and I'm wanting to do basically the same thing...how will the sub be positioned in the box for the 10" sub? Rear firing, down firing, or what?
Josh Blackshire - Owner, Ohio Dakotas .NET
Red 98 Dakota Sport - Check it out!
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Skylar Sutton
Dodge Dakota
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9/01/2005
22:45:31
| RE: (2) 8's or (1) 10?
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New console would extend slightly past the old rear console location (by about 2-3"), magnet closer to the middle of the console. Essentially the labeling would face the rear wall of the cab (parallel to it).
This set up provides a fair amount of volume for the speaker, an ideal location for all passengers, and offers a semi-concealed installation (tinted rear windows). Most importantly though, it leaves the front half of the console open for amp mounting, cross-over mounting, etc.
- Skylar
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Lurkin
Dodge Dakota
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9/06/2005
13:59:33
| RE: (2) 8's or (1) 10?
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I'd say it depends on what you want. Personally I prefer quality over quantity, so I'd pick a single 10". It will provide a bit deeper sound, and should provide a better SQ.
I'm not a big fan of multiple sub installations though, a bit over the top for a room the size of a closet :-)
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iMacattack
Dodge Dakota
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9/11/2005
19:54:31
| RE: (2) 8's or (1) 10?
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Well I'm in your same boat... but 2-8"s is the way I'm going. I already have old school Kicker solo 8's. They are the older round solo series. Plus I'm running thme with my old school HiFonics Odin amp.
I have a Quad cab and I'm designing the box to fit behind the pasanger side of the rear seat. I have run the numbers and it all seems to work.
I'm keeping a photo journal and will post a link for everyone to see what I did and why.
Cheers
Jan
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GraphiteDak
GenIII
9/12/2005
23:32:25
| RE: (2) 8's or (1) 10?
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Are you talking about some sort of REAR seat console, or are you guys talking about the middle console up front?
That thing sure doesn't have enough room for a 10 in MY truck :p
Tonight I began more surgury on my Dak. I hacked another 10" box down to where it can fit behind my LEFT rear seat. the SMALLER one of the 60/40 split.
Well, I got it half a$$ed in there right now and only one bolt in the seat for tonight. It got too late to work on it any more. But the seat IS sitting there and the back hooked on the extended mounts. Seats each moved forward 1.5 inches BTW (which I've mentioned 100 times, but just a reminder).
Anyway. I have my RF sub in the right rear, which HAS been there.
And I threw in some old MTX Terminator 10" sitting around collecting dust just to get it up and running and doing tests running the two 10's in the truck.
It don't sound that bad actually! While I'm running the amp stereo now it IS louder than the one RF sub by itself without driving it until it explodes. (which it's done to me 4 times!)
Well, just getting in on the convo, again since we're always talking SPACE to install subs in a Dak.
I'll take some pix next time I work on it. It's kind of HACKED up right now :p
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Skylar Sutton
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
9/13/2005
00:13:21
| RE: (2) 8's or (1) 10?
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Yes, front console, inbetween the driver and the front passenger. There's plenty of room for not only a 10", but also and amp, and a capacitor. The biggest issue is that the dimensions between the seats is exactly 10" at the seat backs... so, to counteract that I am extending the box about 1.5" past theold console into the rear seating area. This allows the sub to mount (slightly protrouding) on a wider face of the box, which narrows back down to 10" when it meets the seat.
I'll try to get some pictures together once I start glueing, etc.
- Skylar
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GraphiteDak
GenIII
9/14/2005
00:16:37
| RE: (2) 8's or (1) 10?
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Yeah. Pix be cool.
So you are REMOVING the console all together for the box?
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Skylar Sutton
Dodge Dakota
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9/14/2005
07:31:02
| RE: (2) 8's or (1) 10?
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Correct, it's actually already out of the truck... and currently in peices on the floor in my living room. =)
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GraphiteDak
GenIII
9/14/2005
11:50:43
| RE: (2) 8's or (1) 10?
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Cool.
Well I guess that's one way of doing it. You just lose your console in the process.
So, did you CUT the console where it molds into the front cup holders?
I don't see what year your truck is listed as. In my 2003 it's kind of one piece molding into the front cup holders.
I lost partial use of my console by installing the computer hardware in it. But it's still there.
On this truck, I'm ATTEMPTING to do things that still make it look stock.
I'm home sick today. But maybe I'll get a chance to go work a little bit more on installing my second 10" sub behind the left rear seat.
It's in there now. But still too tight to bolt the seat back in. I need to pull the sub and shave 1/16th or so off of the side of the box.
I'll take some pix and post them.
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DSW
Dodge Dakota
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9/14/2005
14:38:43
| RE: (2) 8's or (1) 10?
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Here's some food for thought...
http://www.dodgedakota.net/boards/aud/3528.html
This is a 12" center console sub box, but shows how it's knotched into the center console. If you haven't searched the old posts I'd suggest doing so, there's a couple of other posts of guys who built QC center console sub boxes for 10's, down-fire, rear-fire.
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GraphiteDak
GenIII
9/14/2005
17:42:25
| RE: (2) 8's or (1) 10?
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Hey DSW. Looking at your past pix there. Is that a CAR SEAT in the back of your truck???
LOL. My wife is wanting us to have another baby real bad. Our kids are 10 and 8. Hard to imagine starting that baby stuff over, but you know women!
So what does the FRONT of your truck look like where the console stops. Do you STILL have cup holders? Assuming yours is a similar setup to my QC.
Here's the LATEST as of today...
That box on the right was in our Grand Caravan. I pulled it out and it is about the same depth as my other rear sub. I then CUT it down to just 16.25" wide. Just small enough to fit behind the LEFT rear seat.
When I took the box form the Caravan, I put that MTX Sub into that box on the left that was a spare.
It sounded horrible, and the wife drives that to work and she complained! The MTX needs lots of air space. I even tried tuning it with a port and extra inso inside. No dice.
So I had to buy a new box for her, just a square type sealed around 1 CuFt. It sounds a lot better now.
So anyway. Back to the Dak. I trimmed that box to just fit between the brackets behind the seat. I had to notch the wood hear and there to get it to fit. It finally did.
Then I installed it with this old school MTX Terminator. Just for now until I can go buy another RF P2 to match what I have behind the other seat.
There's the box I've had behind the right rear seat. It LOOKS much bigger, because it is about 5 inches wider. BUT. When they quit making the RF HE series, they replaced it with the P2 series. ANd when that happened the specs went from a full 1CuFt sealed box to .75 CuFt sealed box. So in that box I have several 2X4's taking space inside reducing the space to .75 Cu Ft. Maybe some day I'll remove it and trim it down like the other one.
The new ones using the reduced sealed space was actually a blessing as there isn't much room behind these seats. And that's the only way possible to get one behind the LEFT rear seat as it is narrower than the RIGHT rear seat.
And there you have it. TWO 10" subs behind the seats. I'm now running the amp stereo and should be less likely to blow them up like when I was running one sub very hard. Right now I'm limited until i pull that old MTX for a like RF to match the other one. But it sounds fairly good as it is.
And here's the best part I think.
After all that work modifying the seats and all. They STILL fold up in front of the subs and my two kids (maybe soon to be 3) can STILL sit back there with plenty of room.
It would be cool to have two 12's back there. But I don't know if THAT is possible with what it took to make a way for two 10" subs to fit.
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akajoker
Dodge Dakota
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9/14/2005
21:43:57
| RE: (2) 8's or (1) 10?
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I've had 2 8"s (JL Audios) pulled them built 1 box that went across the entire back behind the rear seats for 2 10"s, that was alot better than the 8"s, but still not enough, pulled that set-up 2 wks ago and went the center console route, removed entire console, built box for 1 Kicker L5 rear firing. Tons better than the 2 10"s behind the seat, but still not as good as I would like it, talked to Kicker today, started laying out my install to the tech, he cut me off and told me this is an easy one, the sub should be down firing! Said I was getting a lot of cancellation with the sub firing toward the rear. I don't mind loosing the storage space with the console and the newer dakotas the center console isn't molded in with cup holders, they are seperate, and NOW seeing the post that DSW referenced, I'm almost kicking myself for not doing more research than I did, cuz I would have definately went the 12" route if I had only known! Next project.... new box for down firing 10"!
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GraphiteDak
GenIII
9/14/2005
22:37:31
| RE: (2) 8's or (1) 10?
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Yeah. I was wanting to know if DSW's console was like mine where it molded into the front cup holders (mine has three cup holders) or if some of your consoles are different.
I think what your kicker guy said could be very true. But it could not be predicted. You just have to try it.
5 guys here could build 5 boxes form scratch and use the same speaker/amp etc and come out vastly different in some cases.
You get some sound that reverbs off of the cab and cancels out the sound, especially in low frequencies.
Moving a sub around kind of helps. In a house it's easy to move a sub and find the sweet spot.
In out Dak's it's another story and you are kind of stuck with starting over if it's really bad.
All in all, I'd have to say two 10's SHOULD be better than one 12 for sure.
But, if the one 12 is installed and has less cancellation (standing waves) than the 2 10's set up, then that would be the case.
But if the two 10's work out, that should be the best route over one 12.
I'm someone who has built and experimented with more than one box/setup in my vehicles trying to get it as best I can.
All in all, the down firing method may be better than the port being to the rear. But you will have to try it to find out!
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blrichards2
Dodge Dakota
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9/15/2005
02:23:46
|  RE: (2) 8's or (1) 10?
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GraphiteDak: You have 2 great options. 1- Only remove the cupholders on the floor and build a fiberglass down firing sealed enclosure for a single 10"(preferably Daimond Audio D3). Pad and vinyl it looks factory no one knew where my sub was. I still have the enclosure and will sell it. 2- Remove the entire front center console and armrest. Build a single 10"(Diamond Audio D6)down firing rear ported enclosure. I could get you a cut sheet and pics of my truck. I have been installing professionally for 11yrs. The past 4yrs for CarTronics in Nashville, TN. You can even do 2-10"s down firing but it looks akward in there.
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blrichards2
Dodge Dakota
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9/15/2005
02:33:54
| RE: (2) 8's or (1) 10?
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bty- I have a 2001 Dak Quad Cab.
Option 1 is a clean install with tight bass.
Option 2 is all about the bass most people don't believe it's only a 10" when I demo my truck.
I am currently build a fiberglass enclosure that holds a 10" down firing, rear ported and encorporates the fold down armrest and storage compartment so you could still use the center seat in a pinch. It's been a pain but I'm almost done. If you want pics just let me know.
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DSW
Dodge Dakota
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9/15/2005
20:45:13
| RE: (2) 8's or (1) 10?
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Yeahhhh,,, that's one of 2 car seats,,, and the wife wants another one also... I always bring up the subject when BOTH of the kids are being a real PITA and driving her up the wall ;-)
I have the console with one BIG cup holder directly in front of the console and two adjustable cup holders on the floor. I cut the lower rear section out of the console for the sub box to fit into, cut out was something like 10" high and 14" long. I still have about 2" of storage under the flip-up top and access to the 12V power outlet.
The 1-12" Infinity Perfect in my QC sounds better than the 2-10' RF XLC subs in my ol' 00 CC, punchier and deeper bass. Both running off an RF 301S amp, the 12 is just about right being powered by 350Wrms, but the 10's were a bit underpowered. I think it has to do with the direction the subs were firing, 12 is a down fire but the 10's were an up fire. Just know that my current single 12 setup in my QC kicks azz all over the dual 10's, might be a different story if I had run more power to the 10's...
Graphite, I wasn't going to go down the "subs behind the seats road" since I wanted to have my seats fold up, looks like you got it to work by moving the seat mounts forward,,, good show!
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akajoker
Dodge Dakota
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9/15/2005
22:08:31
| RE: (2) 8's or (1) 10?
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bl.. i would be interested in seeing pics of your set up. I'm not going to need to do any fiberglass work on mine, I am going to do the downfire towared the rear of the box(box slightly tapers in from back to front) but I would still like to see some pics of your set-up.
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GraphiteDak
GenIII
9/15/2005
22:10:24
| RE: (2) 8's or (1) 10?
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Yeah thanks.
I really have no desire to build one in place of my console now. I was just curious on what you two DID with you console. My console is like yours DSW. The BIG holder (which is awesome) and the two adjustable ones).
Anyway, I've finally got the two 10's in the back now and my computer is up in the bottom of my console where I like it.
Both of my amps are UNDER the rear seats. The seats don't fold straight up anymore as they contact the sub enclosures when I do. I can lift them up enough to access the amps for fine tuning.
They do fold down though when you lift the bottom up slightly and unhook the backs.
I think it's perfect for me and when I run TWO high performance 10's and some power it SHOULD pound pretty hard. The single 10" was doing pretty good there. But when I'd turn the 30Hz way up with the EQ to where it was really loud, the sub would die soon after so I had been careful with it. With two I should get my desired volume form them. The P2 has the leong excursion (throw) but I don't think the 2" voice coil is heavy duty enough.
Now I've got to install some 3 way components in the back. I have some in a plastic enclosure that I've had for a while that sound good. Thought of making a braket to hold them up high off of the rear headliner. Then disconnecting the rear door speakers. They are almost useless back there down that low anyway.
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