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Adam
Dodge Dakota
10/08/2001
19:45:04
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 Subject: Thunderforms?
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Anyone here have one of those MTX Thunderforms with the two 10s? I'm considering getting one but I'm skeptical on how good it's going to sound. I've got two 12s right now and I want to down grade because that box takes up too much room but I still want to have some decent bass.
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steveo
Dodge Dakota
10/08/2001
21:06:45
|  RE: Thunderforms?
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i have one with an mtx 500watt amp, sounds really good, some say it sucks but mine really thumps
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SinCity R/T
Dodge Dakota
10/09/2001
02:56:26
| RE: Thunderforms?
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The thunderform 10's will not be able to match the performance of 12's in a well-built box, especially in the deep range. However, I've found the performance to be exceptional considering they're completely hidden from view underneath the back seat (beats the living hell out of the R/T's stock 8-speaker Infinity system).
Make sure you have an adequate amp as the thunderform with speakers pre-installed are bridged internally with a single terminal at 4 omhs. Not too many amplifiers will bridge at 4 omhs (typically 1 or 2) so your max wattage will be cut in 1/2 or 1/4 if your resistance doesn't match up. Otherwise order it empty and drop in a good pair of 10" subs so you can keep them at 4omhs per channel to a 2-channel amplifier.
SinCity R/T
2001 Silver CC R/T
http://users.lvcm.com/stcr
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Dave_K
Dodge Dakota
10/09/2001
07:22:43
|  RE: Thunderforms?
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Sincity R/T >
Could you take them out of the box and "un bridge it".. Wouldnt it just be a matter of unhooking the wires?
Or are the speakers 8ohm speakers? so that wen bridged they are 4...
Also, just sticking any other sub in that box, wouldnt it be the wrong size? Therefor making the bass not as deep?
Could you add a resister to increase resistance?
Thanks!
Dave.
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DarkFury
Dodge Dakota
10/09/2001
14:41:04
| RE: Thunderforms?
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Ummm... I slightly disagree with some of what SinCity R/T said... (just about the part about the Ohmage on the stock Thunderform and using amps with it.)
The "factory" Thunderforms are two 8 Ohm 10" Thunder 6000s.. Bridged together they present a 4 Ohm mono (or 2 Ohm stereo...whichever way you wanna call it) load for your amplifier (if you have a "mono" amp or a 2 channel which is bridged).
Most 2 channel amps worth their "salt" will bridge down easily to this 4 Ohm mono (2 Ohm stereo) load... so no problem there. Personally, I would use a mono amp, but if that is not an option, then don't worry too much about it.
Now if you by chance didn't go with the "factory pre-loaded" Thunderform and threw your own pair of 4 Ohm 10" subs in there, then your amp would be seeing a 2 Ohm mono load (1 Ohm stereo)...which would in fact blow alot of 2 channel amps that aren't rated to go that low (Like SinCity said...there are only a few that can do this and they are EXPENSIVE!!!!).
Like I said...personally, I would use a mono amp on the Thunderform in this situation, however there are a few 2 channel amps that can hang... just be careful if you put your own speakers in there and they were rated at 4 Ohms or lower.
If you just have the "stock" loaded Thunderform, you really shouldn't have much of a problem with any decent amp... the Ohms on that unit aren't all that low and you should be fine. Just make sure to deliver "clean" power to the subs with a decent amp because distortion will kill your subs way faster than sending too much power to them.
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Jim
Dodge Dakota
10/09/2001
17:42:11
| RE: Thunderforms?
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I went from two PPI 12" to the thunderform and I am very pleased with the sound. Unless you listen to a lot of rap or demand over powering bass don't worry about having two 10"s, so give the thunderform a shot. You will not notice a difference between stereo and mono if you use a low pass filter. Just feed the subs lots of power and you will be happy.
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Audio God
Dodge Dakota
10/10/2001
22:53:25
|  RE: Thunderforms?
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I don't understand the problem with finding an amp able to bridge to either a 4 ohm or 2 ohm mono load. Almost all "good" amps can accomplish this task, except for Rockford Fosgate I think. One of the big drawbacks to running a 2 ohm load is the amount of current the amp will pull, as well as the amount of heat that badboy will be giving off.
My suggestion for you is to go and get yourself a 10" Kicker Solobaric L7. It'll cost more than your standard run o' the mill speaker but is worth it. Buy a 2ohm DVC and wire the VC's in series for a 4 ohm load. Give that b!tch a good 300-400 watts and it'll shake your teeth in the small confines of a Club Cab. The bonus is that Solobarics use the smallest box of any sub on the market and the things are bulletproof. Feel free to put upto 500 watts to it if you want.
Dave adding a resistor would just reduce the amount of power available for the speakers to use.
DarkFury its called "Resistance" not "Ohmage". HeHeHeHeHeHE
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DarkFury
Dodge Dakota
10/11/2001
01:38:04
| RE: Thunderforms?
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Audio God..
I was referring to the OHMAGE of the loaded Thunderforms (as in 2 8 Ohm speakers) versus the resistance that they produce.
You still got the point though... So just keep laughin'.
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Audio God
Dodge Dakota
10/11/2001
02:29:00
| RE: Thunderforms?
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I think you need a basic electronics class Fury. There is no such term as "Ohmage". Ohms is the scale by which "Resistance" is measured. Much like the way we use "Pounds" as the scale for "Weight".
All electronic circuits produce some type of resistance whether it be through a "load" like a tweeter, a subwoofer, or just the current traveling through the wire.
So now you can say...Those subwoofers have a RESISTANCE of 2 ohms. If you wire them in series you will have a RESISTANCE of 4 ohms.
BWAAHAHAHAHAHA
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Dave_K
Dodge Dakota
10/11/2001
07:02:05
| RE: Thunderforms?
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Ohm My God Guys... Heh... Lets not get mad. I had no clue that Ohm's was a rating of resistance either. Its OK, he got the point across with the word "Ohmage".
Anyway, Would adding a resister across the wires (Crossing pos and neg) increase the Resistance, as well as cause a loss in power? Or would that Decrease the Resistance, and cause a loss in power...
I recall by adding it in-line, as apposed to crossing the circuit, it will change the load... Obvisouly not the best way to do it, but how much power does it suck up? 2 bucks at Radio Shack is better than 400 on a new amp right?
Now, Imagine yourself walking around a Sound Off... THen you hear... Oh My God! Look at his OHMAGE! Dark Fury> I think you may have struck gold here eh?
Thanks
-Dave
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Jim Marshall
Dodge Dakota
10/11/2001
13:21:02
| RE: Thunderforms?
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Just get two 8 ohm speakers or a class D amp (which can handle a 2 ohm mono load). Why bother getting resisters.
If you can't then wire your 4 ohm subs in stereo. This would be about the same amount of power as two 8ohm subs bridged setup.
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Audio God
Dodge Dakota
10/11/2001
15:45:16
| RE: Thunderforms?
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Dave give up the whole resistor theory man. It ain't going to work. There are alot of smart guys that work at the Amplifier Factories, don't you think they would of thought of something that simple?
Sorry if I offended anyone. I'm just trying to pass on some of the useless knowledge in my cranium.
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DarkFury
Dodge Dakota
10/11/2001
21:34:56
| RE: Thunderforms?
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Audio God... you are being an "audio jerk".
If the term "resistance" makes you feel better, then that's fine... hell most people would know what I meant, but geez.. you wanna be a "stickler" for terminology.
Everything else I said is on the money... so just go away Troll boy.
There's always ONE! Jerk.
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DarkFury
Dodge Dakota
10/11/2001
21:45:46
| RE: Thunderforms?
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BTW.. Audio God since you are so smart and all...
Check out some of these links:
ohmage. The American HeritageŽ Dictionary of the English
Dictionary.com: Ohmage
So I guess someone else out there believes "Ohmage" is a word. I even saw a few sites that listed their electrical products based upon their "ohmage".
So you can just take this big ol' plate of SHUP and eat it!
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Audio God
Dodge Dakota
10/11/2001
23:58:18
| RE: Thunderforms?
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Sorry dude. I was just trying to spread a little knowledge.
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DarkFury
Dodge Dakota
10/12/2001
02:11:07
| RE: Thunderforms?
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Oh.. you were spreadin' "something" alright... but I don't think it was "knowledge".
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Dave_K
Dodge Dakota
10/12/2001
06:49:00
| RE: Thunderforms?
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Lol!!
Check this out...
Haha, you can find alot in that dictionary..
Is PHAT a word? It thinks so...
Click here
-dave
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DarkFury
Dodge Dakota
10/12/2001
11:53:23
| RE: Thunderforms?
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If you noticed... the term "Phat" on that page has a notation of "Slang" next to it.
So I guess it qualifies based upon that notation.
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shane
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
10/21/2002
22:23:13
| RE: Thunderforms?
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I bought a thunderform unloaded and ditched it b/c I didnt want to separate from my Infinity kappa perfects and my Mmatts amp. Their website was very unclear about dimensions so I found out the hard way my Infinities hit bottom. I thought of hacking the thing up a little to make them fit but it just wasnt worth it. So now I decided to task myself with building an MDF/fiberglass composite box to take the place of the thunderform. I will tell you its been a bitch so far. I have no idea yet how it will sound. The Dokota so far seems to resist soundstaging due to poor factory speaker position. I really really need some major sound staging up front. Anyone else have this issue? I feel some nice tweets up front will help. Anyway here is a list of my components. If it sounds bad you will understand why I would feel a little sour.
Kenwood Z828 head
JL 300/4 pushing 4 6.5" JL coax's
Mmatts 700.1D for two Infinity Kappa Perfect 10's
Two Kicker RMB8 midbass' between the 10's
I would like any intelligent advice from someone who has been down this road before.
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Aaron Pearson
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
6/30/2003
13:44:44
| RE: Thunderforms?
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Anyone here ever heard of a little box that you wire your subs to that changes the polarity and in turn changes the resistance from 4 ohms to 2 ohms? Well, ive got one but im only 14 and i lost the papers.......can't figure out how to wire it up!
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mpil1
GenIII
7/06/2003
00:41:18
| RE: Thunderforms?
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The "Ohm" rating on a speaker is its impedance, not resistance. Put an Ohm meter across a speaker and you'll probably see nearly ZERO ohms. Only when you pipe a signal (sound) thru a speaker will the coil's "inductive reactance" go up, thus making the impedance go up. HINT: The impedance (ohm) ratings are rated at a certain nominal frequency. That is, a speakers "ohmage" will actually change as the frequency changes, though not much. The higher the sound frequency, the higher the "ohmage."
OK, now that I've confused everyone, I'm going to sleep now lol. (as everyone thinks, "what a jerk.")
Mpil1
'02 SXT CC, 3.9L, 5-spd, 4x4, LSD, No Real Mods :(
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mpil1
GenIII
7/06/2003
01:01:16
| RE: Thunderforms?
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Aaron Pearson,
Looking back on your post, I'd have to question that little box of yours. Changing polarity simply means to reverse wires connecting to the speaker. That will not change the impedance though. If that box does what it says and changes the impedance to 2 ohms, then there must be either a resistor or a coil in there that "simulates another speaker," per sey. If that is the case (most likely), then using that box will serve no benefit at all. Heres Why:
For simplicity, say your amp puts out 100W into 4 ohms, then it can put 200W into 2 ohms. I won't explain why, it'd take too long. If you hook up one 4 ohm speaker to it, then that speaker will get 100W. Now, say you hook up the "Box" to change the load to 2 ohms; now you have a 2 ohm load on your amp. BUT, that 200W is now gonna get divided evenly between the speaker, and that "resistor" in the box that simulates another speaker. So look now, amp is indeed driving 200W out, but that 200W is getting divided EVENLY between the "dummy" resistor or coil in that box, and your speaker.
So whats happening? "Box" is using 100W and speaker is still only getting...thats right..100W. No different that if you hooked it up alone.
Now I've never heard of a box like that so who knows, maybe I'm wrong. But from the sounds of what its supposed to do, I am right electronically; thats how it would have to work. Sounds like sort of a rip off device to me. :(
Mpil1
'02 SXT CC, 3.9L, 5-spd, 4x4, LSD, No Real Mods :(
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