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Adam
Dodge Dakota
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5/21/2003
17:59:19
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 Subject: true dual exhaust
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Message:
I have a 97 dakaot 4x4 ext cab with a 318 and I'm thinking about going to custom exaust shop and having them install a true dual exhaust with headers and flowmaster american thunder mufflers. Does anyone have something like this, if so what kind of performance gains did you get and how does it sound also how much did it cost.
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Demon Dakota
DakotaEnthusiast
5/21/2003
19:54:47
| RE: true dual exhaust
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Message:
I have true duals. I used Dynomax race mufflers, and 2.5" pipe all the way back. It cost me $311 and sounds absolutely great! I have the 4.7L, but I'm sure the layout is similar (exhaust)...
K&N Drop in AF (CAI during summer months)
True Dual exhaust and removed third cat
HO Cams & HO Intake
FASTMAN 70mm TB
Autolite 3923 Plugs
TPS @ .76 VDC
IAT Adjuster Mod
14.52@94.2 MPH at Silver Dollar Raceway
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Timberwolf
GenIII
5/22/2003
19:13:34
| RE: true dual exhaust
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Be careful, and make sure the guy installing it actually understands the dynamics of muffler systems and is not just a welder. If done improperly, true duals can cause a loss in power. Your engine needs a certain amount of back pressure to make torque. You would probably be better off to just get a cat back system that you can bolt on yourself that has been dyno tested to work with your vehicle unless you know someone that you really trust.
"I'd rather be fishing"
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Demon Dakota
DakotaEnthusiast
5/22/2003
23:43:46
| RE: true dual exhaust
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Message:
Well, if you know what you're doing, then there will be no problems when you tell your exhaust man the layout and specifics of the system.
If you don't have true duals, or if you haven't seen/heard them in action, then please do not provide "advice" to anyone since you are only going on heresay. If you have had or do currently have true duals and have a "power loss" documented, I can guarantee that you didn't put together the right combination of mods to get the necessary flow into and out of the engine.
Timberwolf, this isn't against you personally, but rather a general shout out to those that issue the same statements over and over again with no experience or proof behind it.
If true duals don't work, why the hell does the 4.6L Ford SOHC (used in many of their vehicles) use true dual setup on the Mustang GT? Why do Ferrari and Chevrolet use them for their performance vehicles?
What must be remembered is the fact that true duals by themselves WITH NO OTHER MODS will not be as effective as combining other airflow mods together. A warm air or cold air intake do not do anything of great importance by themselves either. A cold or warm air intake combined with a cam, a new intake, and true duals will make a significant amount of difference. This backpressure issue is absolute nonsense as well. If you do not understand the physics behind it, I'll gladly conduct an online course on the matter through my private server (when it's done being set up).
Alright, I didn't mean to rant. I just get annoyed at the fact that I am constantly repeating myself on this site, and also that no one searches anymore (the basic questions have been answered HUNDREDS of times over).
K&N Drop in AF (CAI during summer months)
True Dual exhaust and removed third cat
HO Cams & HO Intake
FASTMAN 70mm TB
Autolite 3923 Plugs
TPS @ .76 VDC
IAT Adjuster Mod
14.52@94.2 MPH at Silver Dollar Raceway
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islanderpc
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
5/23/2003
01:16:20
| RE: true dual exhaust
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Message:
torque peak is determined by header primary and collector size and length.
you don't want "backpressure" rear of the collector.
RT's that installed 3.5" single exhaust from 3" from collectors back have said no torque loss noted.
If your headers pipe diameters are too large for your app then your torque peak might be higher than you like.
================
click tech articles...then exhaust notes...see chart.
http://victorylibrary.com/mopar/main.htm
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islanderpc
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
5/23/2003
01:20:55
| RE: true dual exhaust
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Message:
kick ass site isn't it.
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Timberwolf
GenIII
5/23/2003
16:56:14
| RE: true dual exhaust
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Message:
Demon. Take a valium will you. I think you are getting a little to used to having everyone flame you around here. I was just trying to help the guy out, the same as you were. I in no way said true duals don't work. Just because I don't have them on this particular vehicle doesn't mean I haven't on previous vehicles, and, therefore, don't know what I'm talking about. I also have a friend who built Pro Stock dragsters for years and posed this question directly to him several years ago. My information is, therefore, not heresay, but rather from a source who knows how to make big power. If set up properly, they are fine. My point is this: There seems to me to be an unusually high percentage of "technicians" in the muffler business that don't really know what they are doing. Their main concern is throwing together something that looks good. I was just trying to help Adam avoid this. Also, islander is correct in that it changes the power curve. Since most people use the lower end of this curve and opening up the exhaust too much will cause peak to rise. The net effect is the feeling of a power loss. I should have clarified.
"I'd rather be fishing"
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Demon Dakota
DakotaEnthusiast
5/25/2003
12:04:23
| RE: true dual exhaust
IP: Logged
Message:
I wasn't actually angry/pissed at you Timberwofl. It's just that I read about 20+ emails a day from people asking me these questions plus all the boards I respond to...so I kinda got in a sh!tty mood. I really didn't mean to take it out on you or anyone in particular, so please accept my apologies.
To counter the effects of the true duals (moving HP up in the RPM range, along with the HO Cams and Intake), I'm funding the design of long tube headers for the 4.7L. That should (by my calculations) raise the overall HP/TQ curve, thereby countering the effects of true duals. It's a slow process (and expensive as hell!), but I feel it will greatly enhance the 4.7L's future potential.
K&N Drop in AF (CAI during summer months)
True Dual exhaust and removed third cat
HO Cams & HO Intake
FASTMAN 70mm TB
Autolite 3923 Plugs
TPS @ .76 VDC
IAT Adjuster Mod
14.52@94.2 MPH at Silver Dollar Raceway
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Matt
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
5/26/2003
17:57:56
| RE: true dual exhaust
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Message:
guys i'm looking for a Deep-loud sounding exhaust. right now i have a flowmaster 40 series exhaust. what should i do? should i get another flowmaster 40 series and run 2 of them from the headers with no catalytic converter? any help would be great. thanks,
-Matt
fatmat789@yahoo.com
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xplikt
GenIII
5/27/2003
11:01:20
| RE: true dual exhaust
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Message:
For a deep loud exhaust, just keep it single, get rid of the third cat, and dump it after the muffler before the rear axle. It will be very deep. I have that setup right now, but I'll be going true duals in another month or two -- hopeuflly.
-Mike
http://www.dodgetruckworld.com/xplikt/
2002 2WD RC SLT 4.7L 5spd 3.92 LSD
MBRP Single in/out | straight piped 3rd cat | turndown tip
Full Hotchkis and RAS
Shaved emblems and antennae
150BM fan | removed clutch | HD Radiator
R/T wheels on 275/40/17 Dunlop 9000s
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IntenseDak39
*GenIII*
5/27/2003
11:15:21
| RE: true dual exhaust
IP: Logged
Message:
well here is a shout out for the v-sixers.... DONT DO IT!. I ran a true dual exhaust on my truck... 2 1/4" with two flowtech mufflers... no bottom end at all and i would get about 5-7 different codes on the puter.
1998 Regular Cab V6 Auto
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CThomp
*GenIII*
5/27/2003
11:41:33
| RE: true dual exhaust
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Message:
Hey Demon how are the long tube headers coming? I'm sure you get asked that all the time but I had to. I'm anxious. Will I be able to run them with my single exhaust?
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timberwolf
GenIII
5/27/2003
12:16:35
| RE: true dual exhaust
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Message:
No problem Demon.
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Demon Dakota
DakotaEnthusiast
5/27/2003
17:30:54
| RE: true dual exhaust
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Message:
CThomp, I dunno if these will work with the "stock" single exhaust setup, but maybe if you altered it a bit, they would.
K&N Drop in AF (CAI during summer months)
True Dual exhaust and removed third cat
HO Cams & HO Intake
FASTMAN 70mm TB
Autolite 3923 Plugs
TPS @ .76 VDC
IAT Adjuster Mod
14.52@94.2 MPH at Silver Dollar Raceway
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CThomp
*GenIII*
5/28/2003
08:47:37
| RE: true dual exhaust
IP: Logged
Message:
Altered is fine. Pipes bend. Altered how though?
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Randy
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
10/06/2003
17:26:50
| RE: true dual exhaust
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Message:
i want to run true duals on my 94 318 i have after the cat a 40 series flowmaster with 2 pipes out right now but it is to quiet i was wondering what is to be done with the O2 sensor if i were to have true duals and i also am wondering about this 3rd cat you guys are talking about i dont know what it is. The dual exhaust setup im thinking about is shorty headers with dual high flow cats and no mufflers running all the way to the rear let me know any ideas or comments you might have thanks
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Mark
Forum Moderator
10/06/2003
18:30:20
| RE: true dual exhaust
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Message:
I have true duals and the O2 sensor is tapped into the right side only. Its the original sensor and works fine even at 114k miles. I probably should replace it by now though.
-Mark Hryckiewicz
1993 Sport RC SB 5.2L Auto
DodgeDakotas.com
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DakToBasics
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
3/13/2004
23:15:29
|  RE: true dual exhaust
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Message:
Sorry to drag up an old post but I need to know how well getting an o2 reading from one bank really works.
I am installing headers and true duals on a 94 318, and am concerned about the accuracy of the reading.
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Mark
Forum Moderator
3/13/2004
23:37:07
| RE: true dual exhaust
IP: Logged
Message:
I had mine done at 32,000 miles. I now have over 121,000 miles on the original O2 sensor. Its on one bank and I have no problems whatsoever... even with the few modifications I have made. Check my profile to see what Ive done.
-Mark Hryckiewicz
1993 Sport RC SB 5.2L Auto
Mark.DodgeDakotas.com
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DakToBasics
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
3/14/2004
07:44:47
|  RE: true dual exhaust
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Message:
We have almost identical trucks and Mods!
I just installed my MSD6A and colder Autolites this weekend. What a difference! I will have headers and true duals by next weekend.
There are three differences though... I have custom body work from my sister spinning the truck in the rain and hitting a concrete divider, a Mopar PCM and a PowerDemon transmission with a 2200 stall.
Thanks for the prompt reply!
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