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TexasTodd
Dodge Dakota
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11/28/2007
16:33:31
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 Subject: Electric Turbo..you've got to C this...
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http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=230195518972&ssPageName=MERC_VI_RSCC_Pr4_PcY_BIN_Stores_IT&refitem=230193685383&itemcount=4&refwidgetloc=active_view_item&usedrule1=StoreCatToStoreCat&refwidgettype=cross_promot_widget
It actually Looks half descent. What what the amp draw on this pupppy is?
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Stan
Dodge Dakota
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11/28/2007
17:56:37
|  RE: Electric Turbo..you've got to C this...
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i just put one on my blender
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Yeah Right
Dodge Dakota
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11/28/2007
19:01:25
| RE: Electric Turbo..you've got to C this...
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Now go ask the seller:
What is the no-load rpm of the fan?
What is the air output of this fan in cubic ft/min with filter installed?
Does the fan run only at Wide Open Throttle, or all the time?
Is the fan speed constant, or does it vary with engine rpm?
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4.7onN02
Dodge Dakota
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11/28/2007
19:37:27
| RE: Electric Turbo..you've got to C this...
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Just because it looks nice doesn't mean it works. No way that things gonna even feed a 4 cyl. That motor is way to small and look at the wires, they would melt under any serious draw. It might work on a go-cart or maybe a lawnmower.
The real deal is gonna come when used cheap/used hybrid batteries start hitting the market. They are lightweight and have more than enough power.
Heres the only electric sc I have ever found up to this point that works. It is not recommended for v-8s though.
http://www.boosthead.com/home.php
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TexasTodd
Dodge Dakota
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12/05/2007
13:20:52
| RE: Electric Turbo..you've got to C this...
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4.7 on,
It looks like the same centrifigul turbo attached to a similiar electric engine. Nice website, thanks for the link.
It keeps saying up to 8 liters, yet all the applications are for a V6 max.
The dyno graph they posted is not that impressive, seeing how my N/A 4.7, blows the hell out of those #'s.
It is an interesting idea, but I'd want it full time like a turbo/super, that like an N2O bootle. Maybe soon they'll have the battery technology down, seems like they already should though, seeing as how high tech things are lately.
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.boB
Dodge Dakota
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12/06/2007
11:10:50
| RE: Electric Turbo..you've got to C this...
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Yeah, these gimmicks come up pretty often. Mostly on e-bay. There must be a bunch of morons buying them, because they never go away.
What you're looking at is a heater fan. I'v also seen bilge vent fans sold for the same application.
Do they work? No way. There's no way a small fan like that can move enough air to feed a small engine. And to pressurize an engine takes a lot of power. All it does is create a restriction in the intake track. And makes your wallet lighter.
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TexasTodd
Dodge Dakota
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12/06/2007
12:19:05
| RE: Electric Turbo..you've got to C this...
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.boB,
That's no bilge pump. I've never seen a heater fan that looked like a turbine.
These look just like a tubine of a turbo.
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daddio
Dodge Dakota
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12/06/2007
12:23:47
| RE: Electric Turbo..you've got to C this...
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i don't know Todd. judging by that first picture it sure looks like just a squirrel cage blower in a turbo shaped housing to me.
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Mucho mas
Dodge Dakota
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12/06/2007
20:16:23
| RE: Electric Turbo..you've got to C this...
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Here's a few more:
http://www.electricsupercharger.com/index.html
http://www.electricchargers.com/
http://www.turbomagazine.com/tech/0406tur_knight_turbo_electric_supercharger/index.html
http://www.autoaccessorystore.com/home_n.asp?dir=detail&id=952
VIDEO!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iFWJ_amrCh4
and of course there's the ever-present ebay sellers preying on the un-informed
http://search.ebay.com/electric-turbo-supercharger
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4.7onN20
Dodge Dakota
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12/06/2007
20:54:20
| RE: Electric Turbo..you've got to C this...
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LOL most of those are pretty funny. I hate to tell you this but the 3rd one does work. It costs like $3000 to get it working good and it only works well on 4cyls.
I bet an electric water pump would give you more power than those things.
I am very interested in electric supercharger and hope to someday build one. I just want to do to piss people off at the track because nobody thinks it is possible.
The electric motors are there but still need some better batteries. Im sure A123 will come out some killer lithium ion batteries in the next 5 years.
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.boB
Dodge Dakota
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12/07/2007
22:17:50
| RE: Electric Turbo..you've got to C this...
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>> I am very interested in electric supercharger and hope to someday build one. I just want to do to piss people off at the track because nobody thinks it is possible. <<
It's not only possible, it's been done. Over the years a number of companies have tried it, including the Big 3 and some Japanese companies.
All you need to do is build an electric compressor that will withstand continuous pressure use, and supply enough constant air to feed a real engine. The problem is that the electric motor required to do this is huge and heavy. And where does the electricity come from? You have to use a huge alternator/generater to make enough power. Running something that big sucks up so much power it isn't worth the effort. It would be like running your home 2 stage air compressor off DC power, and try to feed a 4 cylinder engine with it.
So you bypass the alternator and run the compressor directly off the crank shaft. Hmmmm, I wonder if that would work? ;)
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4.7onN20
Dodge Dakota
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12/08/2007
00:31:31
| RE: Electric Turbo..you've got to C this...
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You could use a smaller motor. It doesnt have to be rated for 50 hp you could just use a 25 hp motor and give it some extra juice to make it 50. It should work just fine since it is only running in 15 second bursts and wont have time to overheat. Interesting idea about the crankshaft but I think the coolest thing about the whole electric s/c is that it uses no engine hp. If you can keep the weight down it should make a faster car than turbos or superchargers
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hmmm
Dodge Dakota
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12/08/2007
00:34:16
| RE: Electric Turbo..you've got to C this...
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Here's the thing. Go study physics and then come back. I'm saying this to be mean but if you do you'll soon realize that it can't be done.
A compressor running directly off the crankshaft already exists...it's called a supercharger.
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.boB
Dodge Dakota
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12/08/2007
19:48:48
| RE: Electric Turbo..you've got to C this...
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>> I think the coolest thing about the whole electric s/c is that it uses no engine hp. <<
Were that only true. That would be Holy Grail of fuel mileage and performance. Where does the electricity come from?
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4.7onN20
Dodge Dakota
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12/10/2007
21:51:34
| RE: Electric Turbo..you've got to C this...
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The battery charger in your garage :)
That would be the only way to get hp out of this. You need a good very large battery (like a hybrids) and maybe a large cap for the power burst. Im not trying to defy physics im just storing energy for a later time.
You could hook it up to the cars system for slow charging but if you had a large lithium ion battery then it would be good for quite a few runs.
Oh and hmmm your a retard. If batteries can get the killacycle down the quarter in under 8 seconds I see no reason it couldn't spin a supercharger. You better forget physics buddy and start trying to get some common sense. Guys like this are the reason I would like to do this. I just really really wanna see their face when I piss in there cornflakes
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.boB
Dodge Dakota
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12/11/2007
10:48:30
| RE: Electric Turbo..you've got to C this...
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Sure, on a drag strip only car, you could make it work pretty easily. A couple of deep cycle marine batteries to run the motor for 20-30 seconds. Then back to the pits for a recharge.
You could even do it with off the shelf parts. A Paxton blower and a big DC electric motor. Connect them together with a simple pulley system.
But trying to get something like that to run longer than a few minutes would be difficult. You'll need a power source, which creates it's own problems - mostly weight. If you gain 100hp, but add 500#, you may not have gained anything.
You could try running it off the engine, but that has so far been elusive. You could add a couple of batteries and a small gas powered generater. There's the weight thing again.
OTOH, a simple off the shelf turbo or blower system will accomplish the same thing for a lot less money and complexity. And with much greater efficiency.
It's like getting a 4 cylinder Mustang to run 8's. It can be done, but why bother? Unless it's just a fun engineering exercise.
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4.7onN20
Dodge Dakota
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12/11/2007
15:59:36
| RE: Electric Turbo..you've got to C this...
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Im not going to be to be trying it anytime soon. Im still waiting for battery tech to get better.
I was thinking of using it more like nitrous in short wide open throttle only bursts. I would set up an extra injector for the fuel and once the pedal hits the floor the s/c and the injector come on. Instant Boost.
I don't think it needs to be a track only car I mean how often do you go wot on the street. Even if it did go empty it would be just like running out of nitrous.
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.boB
Dodge Dakota
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12/11/2007
17:42:31
| RE: Electric Turbo..you've got to C this...
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Now that's an interesting idea. You might be on to something there.
Gradually spin the motor up from 75-80% throttle, to full speed at 100% throttle. You could use a 120-150A alternator, a large battery, and an isolater. It would suck out the battery power under boost, and then you'de have time to recharge the battery at light throttle operation.
You'de need a moderate torque electric motor that would spin up to about 8-10K rpm's.
With the newer aftermarket computer systems, EFI and ignition wouldn't be that hard to do. The computer would adjust fuel and spark according to rpm and manifold pressure.
With the computer control of the EFI and ignition, if you overuse the turbo and run out of power, that shouldn't be a big deal.
Of course, if you have to meet emissions, you're sunk.
It would be a fun engineering exercise, but I doubt that it would have the drivability and reliabilty you'de want for a street vehicle. I've only owned one turbocharge vehicle over the years. High boost at light throttle is a good thing.
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4.7onN20
Dodge Dakota
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12/11/2007
21:56:37
| RE: Electric Turbo..you've got to C this...
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Yea it might not be as fun as a regular S/C at
partthrottle on the street but it should make
more horsepower per psi than a regular S/C or Turbo.
That means more HP without more stress on your
motor and thats a very good thing.
Damn it I want batteries to get cheaper more
compact and lighter NOW!!! :) This project just
sounds like fun. Time consuming but still fun.
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Tnjones
Dodge Dakota
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1/08/2008
20:53:48
| RE: Electric Turbo..you've got to C this...
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Your still missing the point. There are inherent inefficiencies in converting mechanical energy to electric, back to mechanical rotation on one shaft that must then be converted to a second shaft (from the motor to the compressor)then to air pressure. each conversion costs a significant portion of the input energy. Then you've got to consider the weight (like they've already been saying, but you seem to refuse to hear). You also seem to be of the opinion that more boost means more power with no limit. There's a reason that superchargers and turbos have limited boost. Preignition anyone? You really do need some basic physics. Your idea is an interesting mental exercise, but practically speaking you'd be lucky to come up with a system that compensates for it's own weight and/or power consumption. In other words, a lot of money, engineering and expensive hardware for no net gain. You might add power, but it wouldn't make the car any faster, just more complicated. Apply Occum's razor and cut the crap.
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4.7onN20
Dodge Dakota
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1/09/2008
05:18:15
| RE: Electric Turbo..you've got to C this...
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I think you are the one who is missing the point.
If your driving around normally then you can charge the batterys because you dont need the electric supercharger. Who cares if its not efficient I just want to store power for a later time.
I also never said that more boost is always more horsepower. What I said was more hp per psi. As in a supercharger may make 50 hp at 5psi but a turbo will make 70 hp at 5 psi. Superchargers have alot of parasitic loss, turbos have much less but an electric sc would have none. Also most sc or turbos with all the hardware will weigh well over 100lbs. So as I said once lighter batteries come out this has a possibility of being a pretty sweet setup.
If you think ive gotten away with playing with nitrous for the last 10 years and not known what detonation was then you are crazy.
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